# URGENT ADVICE NEEDED -- Took in a stray.



## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Today I was at the park when a little black kitten walked up to me, being very friendly. It was super skinny so I decided to take it home and see how it is.

I have another black cat, a male, fixed, he will be a year old in October.

The new cat is in another room of the house, the 2 cats have not met each other yet or seen each other.

I think the new cat might be a girl, and only a few months old.

How do I go about this?

My cat Phoenix is already sniffing me intently and meowing around the house (he does that anyways).

I put litter in a spare litterbox for the new cat and she used it right away.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

She keeps getting in the litterbox and rolling around in it, and she keeps brushing up against me and brushing up against my hands.

Pictures:


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## CatMonkeys (Sep 27, 2012)

I would keep the two separated and take her to the vet ASAP.


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## catloverami (Jul 5, 2010)

Continue to keep them separated, until you can take the kitty to the vet for a health check. Skinnyness may be the result of malnutrition and/or worms. Most kittens can get worms from the momacat, and vet should check to see what type of parasites they have (take in a fresh stool sample). Try and get the kitty some weight on before any introductions to your male cat. Then do a gradual intro. As a general rule most adults accept a kitten more readily than another adult cat. Thank you for rescuing this starving kitty.

Living Together - Introducing a New Cat


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Okay this is nasty but I took a picture of his/her genital area........can someone help me find the gender? I am literally clueless with this stuff. Never had a small kitten.

WARNING, CAT BUTTHOLE lol: imgur: the simple image sharer


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

catloverami said:


> Continue to keep them separated, until you can take the kitty to the vet for a health check. Skinnyness may be the result of malnutrition and/or worms. Most kittens can get worms from the momacat, and vet should check to see what type of parasites they have (take in a fresh stool sample). Try and get the kitty some weight on before any introductions to your male cat. Then do a gradual intro. As a general rule most adults accept a kitten more readily than another adult cat. Thank you for rescuing this starving kitty.
> 
> Living Together - Introducing a New Cat



Thank you!

I tried to clip his/her nails, but he/she is way too hyper right now. Can't keep still.

Can someone shed some light on the rolling around in the litterbox thing? Is that.......normal? Is he/she distressed?

Right now it's playing with toys.


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## doodlebug (May 13, 2006)

Looks like a girl to me.

Nail clipping needs to be reserved for a time when she trusts you. Maybe the vet can do it when you go if her nails are really sharp. Definitely keep them separated until you get her to the vet. Then a slow intro. Make sure to wash your hands before handling Phoenix so you don't pass anything. 

Have you checked her for fleas? You want to do that asap as you don't want to get your house infested. Check for ear mites too. 

The litter box thing is pretty normal. Kittens like to play in them. She may also be seeking out the box as a secure place.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I clipped them, she got tired and let me. Hope I didn't do something wrong by doing that too soon. She also will let me rub her belly.


I haven't checked for fleas yet but I will.


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## doodlebug (May 13, 2006)

No it's fine that you clipped them since she let you. Just didn't want to you fight with her about so early in your relationship.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I looked through her fur, I didn't see any fleas. I also have never checked for fleas on an animal before but I didn't see any black flecks or anything like that. Ears looked okay, just a little dirty.

Right now she is laying on a blanket and she keeps doing a kneading motion.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Actually bleh she might have ear mites. What do I do in the mean time before I can get her to a vet?

Can /I/ get ear mites?


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

she's cute. she doesn't look _that_ skinny to me, but she's black so it's hard to tell. like everyone else says, keep them separated until you get her to the vet. i'd find a low cost spay/neuter place as well, she looks old enough to spay. she looks bigger than my black cat did at 6 mos. but mine is a small cat.

yeah, you can get ear mites, just don't rub her head against your ears. does she have a bunch of brown crumbly stuff in her ears? you might be able to swab inside her ears with a cotton ball with a little baby oil on it. I think you can get OTC stuff but the vet def has meds for it.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

How sweet she is! Looks and reminds me of my black kitty Stephano, I rescued him from the woods around Christmas. He was very skinny too, and yeah, he had worms, but that is an easy fix and to be expected. You might be able to find a low cost shot, spay, worm clinic, many of the pet stores now have mobile vets that come around to them and do all those things. Lots of the kitties that have been in shelters seem to spend lots of time sleeping and playing in their litter boxes, my daughter's kitten favorite past time was playing in his litter box and flinging out as much as he possibly could. 

She sounds very sweet, and very thankful to be safe now. Hopefully you can keep her and get her to a vet soon, she sounds very lovable and sweet. Stephano loves to sit in my lap and knead too, and he is the sweetest lap cat I have ever had. This kitty you have found is very sweet and pretty. I'm sure she was really hungry too. Resist the temptation to introduce them until you know for sure that this cat does not have a disease it can pass on to your kitty. Oh, and the flea stuff, I would go ahead and get that on her really quick, if she has been outside, I'm sure she has them. If you take her into a vet, they may sell you a single dose of flea medication, do not buy the hartz or sargent stuff that is cheap over the counter....it is very bad for them. Advantage and Frontline are good, but you can also get Pet Armor, it is a generic of Frontline, and I have used it and it has worked for my cats and it is only $25 at Wal Mart....but only that one from Walmart....none of the other stuff they sell that is cheap. I put Pet Armor on Stephano before I brought him into the house. 

Good luck with the kitty, she is very sweet


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## doodlebug (May 13, 2006)

It would be near impossible to see fleas on a black cat. To check for them, put several sheets of white paper towels or printer paper under her and brush her really well...I tend to brush against the normal grain of the fur and very firmly making sure the bristles get down to the skin. If there are black specs on the paper, wet them...if they turn red she has fleas. The black specs are actually flea poop which are mainly digested blood.


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## marie73 (Jul 12, 2006)

You should put a "found" ad on Craigslist and check the "lost" ads. This could be someone's kitty who got out and there's a family missing this little girl.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

doodlebug said:


> It would be near impossible to see fleas on a black cat. To check for them, put several sheets of white paper towels or printer paper under her and brush her really well...I tend to brush against the normal grain of the fur and very firmly making sure the bristles get down to the skin. If there are black specs on the paper, wet them...if they turn red she has fleas. The black specs are actually flea poop which are mainly digested blood.


The roots of her hair is light gray, just like my cat Phoenix. I didn't see any, but I will do the brush trick.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

marie73 said:


> You should put a "found" ad on Craigslist and check the "lost" ads. This could be someone's kitty who got out and there's a family missing this little girl.


I highly doubt it, this park isn't near any homes. This park is infamous for its stray cats.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

cinderflower said:


> she's cute. she doesn't look _that_ skinny to me, but she's black so it's hard to tell. like everyone else says, keep them separated until you get her to the vet. i'd find a low cost spay/neuter place as well, she looks old enough to spay. she looks bigger than my black cat did at 6 mos. but mine is a small cat.
> 
> yeah, you can get ear mites, just don't rub her head against your ears. does she have a bunch of brown crumbly stuff in her ears? you might be able to swab inside her ears with a cotton ball with a little baby oil on it. I think you can get OTC stuff but the vet def has meds for it.


I see crumbly stuff yeah  I tried to swab it but she won't let me. I guess it tickles.


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## wallycat (Nov 10, 2012)

I am clueless how to tell age on a kitten, but I think REvolution can be used on kittens 7-8 weeks old. You need a rx for it, but if you have a relationship with a vet, you could run and pick some up. Revolution kills fleas and worms and ear mites. It would be a good place to start.
The kitten looks adorable. I know kittens can play/lay in their litter boxes when they are nervous or stressed so it doesn't necessarily mean it has fleas.
I cannot fathom people dumping animals. Just breaks my heart to think someone could knowingly dump such a cutie.
Keep us posted.


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## marie73 (Jul 12, 2006)

When you take her to the vet, they can check for a microchip.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

She doesn't look skinny in pics but she is, if you view her from the top, she is very narrow near the waist.

She is eating and drinking fine. Right now she is just sleeping on a blanket and keeps using both paws and like.....stretching/kneading on the blanket.

Dunno what this means, Phoenix doesn't knead.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

It means she is content and happy and feeling safe and loved, so relieved to be in your loving care. It's a good thing


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

If the cat is healthy after it's checked from the vet, when is a good time to introduce the 2 cats? Would I need to get her fixed first?


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

howsefrau32 said:


> It means she is content and happy and feeling safe and loved, so relieved to be in your loving care. It's a good thing


Hope so. She also purrs when I pet her. But I read that purring can also be a sign of distress. I mean why would a cat be happy that I abruptly took her from her cat family and surroundings and plopped her in my house? :-?

I hope you're right XD


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Trust me, she is happy. Yes, she is probably a little stressed, but not as stressed as living out in the wild, having to scrounge for food and worry about predators. Yes, purring can be a sign of distress too, but I don't think so in this case. When I took my Stephano in, from living out in the woods....he was skinny, starving, scared to death. We put him in our garage the first night, as soon as he ate, climbed up in our laps....curled up on our chest, under our neck, and purred and kneaded and eventually slept. He was SO relieved to be inside, it was like he just collapsed in total relief. I'm sure, even though this kitty was snatched out of it's environment, it is quite happy to be inside right now, and safe. You are it's guardian angel right now.:angel


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

She keeps doing this one thing where she stretches one paw out, puts it down, and then stretches the other paw out and does this over and over, like in the air lol it's so weird.


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## spirite (Jul 31, 2012)

She's air-kneading.  But I agree with the others that the kneading is a sure sign that she's happy. She's absolutely adorable. I hope that she checks out ok at the vet and that they don't find a microchip. That way you can keep her.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Awww you're right, she is doing this:


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## pkbshrew (Feb 13, 2013)

She looks and sounds adorable. Thank you SO much for taking her in. She's going to reward you with bucket loads of love for years to come! Do a search on the forum for info re introductions between her and your existing boy. The vet will let you know when she can be spayed, she looks big enough to me but the vet might want her to be a little plumper first.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

I know Revolution is supposed to kill ear mites, but if you have an existing problem with them, it may not be enough....my feral has them and she is on Revolution and it doesn't seem to be helping. I had heard about using olive oil, or another type of oil, and I have heard that advice given here also. I found this Ear Mite Remedies about how to go about it. Something you can do. I hope you get them under control soon, poor kitty.


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## Mitts & Tess (Sep 4, 2004)

Ear mites can easily be passed between cats. The vet will swab the ear and look at it under the microscope to see if he can see evidence of them. A shot of Ivermectum will clear them up quickly. If your kitten is 3 lbs it can be spayed/neutered and vaccinated. Your vet will do a wellness check of its health. I would be free feeding kitten food 24/7 . Thanks for rescuing this kitten. He sounds like a great addition to your fur family.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I set up an appointment tomorrow for the kitten. We'll see how it goes. Hopefully nothing is TOO wrong with her.

Also she's been peeing in her littlebox but she hasn't pooped yet :\ She's been eating though. I gave her some "Digestive upsets" drops.


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## librarychick (May 25, 2008)

It could simply be that she hadn't had food for a while so her body is getting every last bit of energy out of the food. If she hasn't pooped by the time your vet appt rolls around you should mention it to the vet, but TBH it should happen soon and I wouldn't be worried yet.

Once you're home from the vet you can start thinking about intros, read this article FIRST! Cat-to-Cat Introductions | Little Big Cat


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I will mention it to the vet if she hasn't gone by then, and thank you for the link  I've been doing a bit of scent swapping. I pet one cat, then pet the other and vice versa. The kitten has been laying on a fuzzy blanket A LOT but I don't want to give that to my cat if she has fleas/ear mites. I guess we'll see.

I will keep you guys posted


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## Marcia (Dec 26, 2010)

Looking forward to updates!!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Phoenix knows something is up, he hasn't eaten any of his food today and he even made a poop outside of his litterbox (near it though) and he's never had an accident like that besides when he was sick.

:\ I wanted to get my cat a playmate but not kill him in the process!

Oh and the kitten pooped


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## Straysmommy (Dec 23, 2010)

You have to spend more time than ever with him and lavish reassurance on him, in any way that works with him. From my positive experience after getting this advice from a great behavorist.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Straysmommy said:


> You have to spend more time than ever with him and lavish reassurance on him, in any way that works with him. From my positive experience after getting this advice from a great behavorist.


Thank you. I've been careful to make sure he doesn't get jealous. If I play with the kitten, I play with him too, ect...


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## Straysmommy (Dec 23, 2010)

I don't think cats get jealous, more like feel scared of another cat and their territory threatened.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Straysmommy said:


> I don't think cats get jealous, more like feel scared of another cat and their territory threatened.


Really? Weird I thought they did. Like they see you paying attention to the new cat and they feel left out and start being a brat lol


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

I don't know about all cats but mine do. my old kitty gets a lot of attention just because she needs it, but then my other two get toys and carry them to my bed or make those eyes like, "Now, ME!"

your cat is probably just more curious at this point than anything else.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I don't think they have seen each other yet at all, not even a glance. But the kitten has been meowing and Phoenix goes up to the door and sits there lol.


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## librarychick (May 25, 2008)

When it's a new cat it's usally stress related. Adult cats REALLY don't like change, so anything that threatens their routine can cause issues from simple 'grumpy eyes' and demand for pets, right through to litter box issues.

I'd suggest thoroughly reading that article, and following it to a T, if you decide to keep the kitten. The positive side to this is that kittens are typically easier to add to your family than trying to get 2 adult cats to accept each other. This way you'll have only one resistant side (your cat) and an adaptable kitten. It does take a bit of the difficulty away, but since the baby looks to be about 6 months (best guess) you do still need to follow the intro process carefully.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

In the mean time, how can I make it so my cat isn't stressed? I feel bad for him. He isn't acting any different besides the not eating and the litterbox accident :\ He still plays with toys and stuff.


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## librarychick (May 25, 2008)

For a cat not eating and going outside the box are signs of fairly high stress level. 'In the wild' cats who show weakness or look upset get eaten, so their instincts tell them to not show the sort of signals we assocaite with illness or stress until they can't help it.

I would start by giving him some extra love and attention, feed him his favorite canned foods...but mainly if you stay calm and relaxed he'll be able to settle a bit better. Take some time to just sit and chill out with him.

You can also look at getting feliway spray, or a plug in. It's sort of like a glade plug in for cats, the scent helps them calm down a bit. Also, leave him a t-shirt you've slept in in his favorite napping spot. Your scent will help him relax even when you're not home.


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## s0mnium (Jun 24, 2013)

i only just adopted my second cat 1 week ago and this article gave me guidance to ensure that I help both cats get used to each other in a step by step process.

What also helped is this product called Feliway which i placed in both rooms and I always make sure that my existing cat gets her share of attention first so that she is reassured that I have not betrayed her. 

so far so good altho each day i get home i brace myself and hope i dont see blood and fur all over the apartment. 

I was very tempted to simply throw them together and expect them to get along but I held back because being patient would be better in the long run as compared to trying to rectify a kitty rebellion for years to come. Hope this helps you Auroraei 

Tips for Introducing Two Cats - Petfinder
FELIWAY - Official Site


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

*Update:* Took Luna to the vet! The little kitty that I thought was 3-4 months old turns out to be 5-6 months old! :O That's the age I got Phoenix, but he was much bigger than Luna. Must be because he's a boy.

She tested negative for feline AIDS and Leukemia :thumb also no fleas!

Buttttttt, she had ear mites (which I suspected), and HOOK WORM EWWW, so they cleaned her ears out which she DID NOT like, and they gave her medicine called Ivermectin which she hated too. It was oral and the vet tried to give it to Luna while she was on my lap and she was NOT having it, she scratched me up and I bled x_x I guess it tastes nasty.

The vet also gave me Revolution to put on both my cats so they can meet soon.

Oh also she weighs 5.25lbs, is that light? The vet didn't really say. I THOUGHT she was skinny. She's very light to me and I can feel her spine and ribs.

Anyways that's about it, guess now I have 2 black cats 

Oh! I also learned that ear mites CAN NOT be transferred to humans.


:blackcat :blackcat


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

she sounds like a perfectly normal weight to me, especially if she's six months. she's almost exactly the same size as my cat, and she'll most likely fill out in the next couple of years. mine was a decent weight at a little over seven pounds but I would settle for six. she's 5 lbs. 4 oz. now and I struggle to keep her over five. if you can feel her ribs and spine it's okay but they shouldn't be prominently visible. (my cat's hipbones jut a little because she has lost so much muscle mass at 16 but yours definitely shouldn't be. )

if your vet told you ear mites are not contagious to humans, that is incorrect. it isn't likely unless you have extremely close contact or there is a huge infestation, but most mites (scabies that cause mange) and the fungus that causes ringworm are transmittable to humans. it isn't often that people develop ringworm but I have seen it. you can also get mites/lice from a dead bird. they don't live on you (breed and repopulate) but they bite humans. none of these are extremely contagious like head lice in children, but people with lowered immune systems or heavily infested situations (and you probably don't fall into either category) are at risk.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I had 2 different vet technicians and a doctor tell me humans can't get ear mites  Oh well.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Tried to edit my last post but it wouldn't let me. 5 minute time frame is ridiculous. Should be 10 minutes.

Anyways I think they said that ear mites can come on your clothes from outside and be transferred to your pets, but that they don't go in your ear like they do for animals.


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## Straysmommy (Dec 23, 2010)

God bless you for what you did for this kitty. I have no doubt you'll make each other very happy.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I just hope my other cat takes to her.....I really hope. I don't know if he will, it worries me.

Oh and the vet even gave me a discount because I told her it was a rescue


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I have a question for all you cat smart people out there.

The vet told me that Luna has hookworms, so she gave her Ivermectin. I'm reading online that Ivermectin does JACK SQUAT for hookworms. Why would my vet give it to her then?! The vet seemed very knowledgeable :-?

The vet DID give us some Revolution and told us to give it to her tomorrow, but wtf was the Ivermectin for?


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

I believe it was for the ear mites. How old is your other cat? I hope they will get along


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

JungliBillis said:


> I believe it was for the ear mites. How old is your other cat? I hope they will get along


Ohhhhhhh I didn't know, well yay! lol

My other cat is 10-11 months old.

I feel so bad for the kitten. Ever since we got her home, she hasn't been acting "herself". She won't play with toys, won't eat or drink (don't know if she's even hungry or thirsty), and won't leave the windowsill.

I tried to give her some Digestive Upsets but I think that nasty Ivermectin medicine traumatized her. Every time I put the syringe to her mouth she would FLIP out, I even tried wrapping her in a kitty burrito and it didn't help at all, she's strong.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

PICS:


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## Mitts & Tess (Sep 4, 2004)

You need to learn to firmly scuff her to give her meds. 

Your kitty needs a dewormer like Drontal to get rid of hookworm. Hookworm can be very serious to a cat.

Ivermectin is for mites. Too bad the vet didn't give her a shot. Ivermectin is very effective. Esp if the ear mites have gotten deep in the ear canal.

Was your kitten social before the vet visit?


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

Awww she is so beautiful. No doubt she is upset about the vet visit. Give her a few days, and she will get over it. My Billi gave me a cold shoulder and refused to eat treats from me after a vet visit. He also insisted on sleeping in the carrier!!! After a few days, he was back to normal. 

Since your kitty is still pretty young, I think chances are good on them getting along, especially with the new kitten being younger. It's so wonderful that you took her in


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Mitts & Tess said:


> You need to learn to firmly scuff her to give her meds.
> 
> Your kitty needs a dewormer like Drontal to get rid of hookworm. Hookworm can be very serious to a cat.
> 
> ...


I think that is what the Revolution is for. I'm suppose to give both my cats a dose of Revolution tomorrow so they can meet and not have the kitten transfer anything to Phoenix.

Oh also, I did scruff her, but she would spaz out and wriggle away. I think the oral meds they gave her traumatized her because it tasted so bad maybe. The other day I gave her Digestive Upsets out of a syringe and she did pretty well with it, but now after the vet visit she is NOT having it!

Yes the kitten was social, pretty much at least. Shy but she would brush up against you and beg you to pet her head (might've been because of the mites). She's also just lay on a blanket and knead and knead but now ever since she got home, she's been sleeping :\


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

JungliBillis said:


> Awww she is so beautiful. No doubt she is upset about the vet visit. Give her a few days, and she will get over it. My Billi gave me a cold shoulder and refused to eat treats from me after a vet visit. He also insisted on sleeping in the carrier!!! After a few days, he was back to normal.
> 
> Since your kitty is still pretty young, I think chances are good on them getting along, especially with the new kitten being younger. It's so wonderful that you took her in


Hope so. I mean she hasn't eaten or drank anything since she got home. Not even treats. Just sleeping. Doesn't even want to play with Da Bird.

I probably shouldn't be worried but I can't help it. 

I hope I didn't traumatize her and change her forever.


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

I don't think you did. The trip was very stressful for her, and she is upset. She may also be feeling icky from the medicine at the moment. Let her rest. And trust me, Billi did not want to play either after the vet visit. Hahaha. 

Wait and see. I bet she will be doing much better tomorrow.


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## Catmamma (Apr 18, 2011)

The kneading motion is natural. If this was a cat often outdoors, the rolling in the litter (it looks like clumping litter) might be because she has fleas/mites. Get some flea stuff right away. It will take care of common mites if she has any. However, I think she is a he.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Haha a little late to this thread, eh? I still appreciate the comment.

I took her to the vet today, vet confirmed it's a she. Also, no fleas! But eat mites 

Also hasn't kneaded since coming home from the vet today  Poor kitty!


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

she's beautiful!  did you name her yet? I can see in those pictures she's somewhat thin, but not hideously. she will fill out to be a very regal kitty.

give her a day or two, she'll be fine. no, you didn't change her forever. the vet just isn't particularly pleasant for any cat--except I have one that likes to go. as in, he likes the ride. once he gets there, he's like, "ok, I am here to bestow my majesty on everyone, BUT DON'T TOUCH ME." actually he doesn't even mind being touched, but he is real funny about the butt and will not allow them to take a rectal temperature. hahahaha I laughed so hard, he makes the meanest face. it might be different when he's sick, so far he never has been so it's only been well-kitty visits.

and no matter what I do, he always hisses at Diotima after she comes home from the vet. usually just for one day, but she stayed overnight last week so it took him two days. he swats at her. and she has to go again tomorrow. I thought if I took him at the same time he'd smell the same and it would be no big deal, but nope. I took all three of them a couple of months ago and it didn't make any difference. (so i'll never do that again LMAO)


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## Cat Lover Lennie (Jan 7, 2013)

I introduced the babies I adopted to my older cats under a door! When I would take the kittens out of their room, the older cats would go in and sniff around. In my opinion, it's all about smell. If I take 1 to the vet the others will hiss for awhile...they hate vet smell! I also used feliway. Don't expect a love match right off, but I suspect it will go smoother than you think. Male/female combination is the best. If she isn't fixed your male will be VERY interested in her butt. As long as they aren't hurting each other just step back and let them work things out....they are close to the same age so I bet they will become best buddies. BTW my cats always sleep for about 24 hours after a vet visit....it is SO stressful. She is beautiful! You are doing fine!


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## spirite (Jul 31, 2012)

Auroraei, for the digestive upsets, you can try mixing it into wet food. I put a bunch of drops in their drinking water, which is probably why it isn't all that helpful. But I already put Miralax in Celia's wet food, and although it theoretically has no smell, I don't want to push it by additing the digestive upsets, which definitely does have a smell. My cats don't seem to mind it though, and it doesn't seem like Luna does either (or didn't, before the icky med today). 

So the "stray" seems to have found a home...I noticed she's now named.  What a beautiful little girl she is, and Luna fits her perfectly!


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## amelia100 (Mar 12, 2011)

why do people clip their cats claws!????!!!!!!!!!!! I DONT UNDERSTAND IT. Just leave them be! Please! They shave down their own claws naturally!


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## marie73 (Jul 12, 2006)

They most certainly do NOT!!! My girls' claws have tips that could cut through a 6-inch titanium wall safe. It's painless (for the cat).


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## s0mnium (Jun 24, 2013)

my cats dont claw down natrually and i will always prefer to clip their nails so that i dont end up having clawed and bleeding ankles when they decide to play "chase the ankle". 
plus it also saves me the hassle of having to unhook them from the sofa leg when they get stuck from scratching and yowl for me while hanging upside down which serves them right. i always take the opportunity to lecture them when it happens since they cant walk away from me *laugh*


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## librarychick (May 25, 2008)

amelia100 said:


> why do people clip their cats claws!????!!!!!!!!!!! I DONT UNDERSTAND IT. Just leave them be! Please! They shave down their own claws naturally!


Most cats do pull off the claw sheaths as the nails grow...but that makes them super pointy! Cats do NOT naturally file their nails down.

In any case, both of my boys aren't particularly good about scratching their post and they need help removing the older claw sheaths. If I don't trim their nails and pick off the older sheaths the buildup gets very thick and painful for my kitties. It's just a job that this mum's gotta do, for their health and comfort.

*note* both my girls don't have any issues with claw sheath buildup; Jitzu keeps her claws as sharp and pointy as possible by gnawing her old claw sheaths off...Torri just has never seemed to have a problem with buildup.


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

Hm maybe outside kitties have duller nails? But there is not way I am not clipping my cats' nails. I would be bleeding every day!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Luna is doing a lot better today, she isn't just sleeping all day, she's up and eating and doing stuff. I don't know why I worried so much :roll:

I applied Revolution to the 2 cats, WOW that stuff is hard to apply. I probably did it wrong too. Who knows!

I also did something maybe I shouldn't have :\ After applying the Revolution my cat was just so curious to see/know what was going on in Luna's room that I opened the door and let him PEEK inside just to see Luna, but not let them meet yet. He immediately started to growl and hiss. I've NEVER heard him growl or hiss! The kitten didn't really care less. Now I'm REALLY scared when these 2 meet face to face that my cat will literally KILL the kitten since he is so much bigger than her.


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## Cat Lover Lennie (Jan 7, 2013)

Yeah! Perfectly normal! Sneak peeks won't hurt a thing. And the beauty of younger cats is that they don't care if they are being growled or hissed at.....their siblings practiced all that with each other daily.
The little one is fine as long as she does not appear scared. Curious is fine. The only thing that you should watch for would be big brother APPROACHING her in a menacing way. If she comes bounding toward him and he growls and hisses and backs up or walks off and pouts...that is fine. And do let him smell her room when you are holding her or put her in a different room. Their is a pecking order that needs to be established.....and they can't do that separately.
The funniest thing that happened in my house was....I brought in 2 two-pound kittens and 7 yr old Katy-Did hissed and growled her head off for a good 2 months. It took another 2 months for her to actually interact with them, but during that time she sat apart from them and watched their every move. Eventually she couldn't resist playing chase with them or taking her turn with Da Bird!
I have two suggestions: RELAX and put a Feliway Calming collar on big brother. It works wonders and he doesn't have to be around a plug-in to get the benefit! 
Keep us posted!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

If anyone thinks I am moving way too fast, let me know. I have a feeling I am. But a part of me is just so anxious for some progress. About a half hour ago me and SO had the idea to open the door to Luna's room and play with Phoenix and Luna with separate wand toys in there. At first Phoenix wanted to sit by the door but slowly he got more comfortable and even ended up about 3-4 feet away from her laying down.

A few times Phoenix couldn't stop staring at Luna across the room even when she was just laying there asleep and he would do a low growl but we'd try to distract him.

Every time Phoenix growled or hissed I'd try to distract him with a wand toy. We even had the idea of brushing both the cats at the same time and Phoenix at a few points got comfortable enough to lay down in there and not worry about Luna. He wouldn't eat any of the treats we tried to give him but Luna did.

He never once tried to run to her and hurt her, and his eyes* never *got big like this O_O like he was going to.

At the end of this supervised session Luna was laying on the floor and Phoenix was slowly walking up to her sniffing around, and Luna moved and Phoenix did a growl/hiss so we decided to end it right there and try again another time.

I took a couple crappy panoramic shots to show how close they were at some points:




















Anyways what do you guys think? Do you think I am moving way too fast, or would this be okay to try again soon?


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

I would go a little slower if possible. the first "second" cat I got was supposed to be isolated in the other bedroom, but she got her paw under the door and got it open and came walking into my bedroom where I was watching tv with my other cat. she was 6 months old and he was about 9, but he was such a mellow cat, that was it.

the second was 8 weeks old and the first kitten was 9, no problem. he started to bug her in about a week but she would just blow him off. 

the third was 20 weeks old, older cats were 13 and 3. I left the kitten in the carrier for maybe three or four days, then started letting him out. the 3 year old played with him a lot, and when the kitten was about 1, he started beating up the bigger one. lol. he still does once in awhile, but for the most part they get along and play together. introducing kittens to mature cats is different I think, but just to make sure yours get on relatively well, i'd try to stretch the process out to at least a week. as long as you say, "play time is over," when someone starts to get hissy and spitty, and don't give them a chance to fight, they'll probably be good. they still might have a confrontation over who gets to be alpha cat or it might just be an understanding. 

good luck having TWO black cats at once lol. (my oldest one is black, the two younger are both lilac points and other people have a hard time telling them apart sometimes but I don't. unless it's dark. )


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## Marcia (Dec 26, 2010)

I think you are doing just fine. Don't stress - the vibes transfer to everyone and makes the situation worse. Act like bringing new cats home is just the most natural thing in the world! Really!! It works!, "oh! another cat just walked through our door?? - I guess I'll just make up another bed!!" 

I firmly believe they feed off our vibes and if you act like this is just the way it is, then they will adjust that much sooner. I think the fact that they are in the same room, resting comfortably is testament to them tolerating each other. Fingers crossed they will become BFFs!

I would do it again a couple, three times tomorrow, then Friday or Saturday open all the doors and let nature take it's course!!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I took them both downstairs to play with Da Bird, they were playing with it separately and at some points even got within a foot of each other, but then other times they got close and they'd both growl and hiss, we did it for a while but then put Luna back in her room.

OH I also want to point out.......at some point downstairs Luna was looking out of the huge window where the sliding doors are that lead to the outside, Phoenix was like a foot away from her just laying there too.......they were giving each other sleepy/blinky eyes.....but they would still hiss/growl? So weird. I swear cats are confusing lol.

Also couple minutes ago Luna was on the windowsill just laying there and Phoenix went on the windowsill too and looked out of the window for a moment, then sniffed around Luna's butt and hissed/growled :\

So now Luna is just in there alone. I think that's enough interaction for today. I already did too much lol.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Yeah! I think the fact that it went so well already.....that is a good sign. I think I'd do like Marcia said, do a few more of these sessions for a few days, then put the new kitty up, before letting them out for good. And give your current kitty lots and lots of love and attention, extra treats maybe, just make her feel really special and loved. And I also agree, they feed off of your vibes bigtime, which is why it never worked in my house because I am a total spaz. My sister has the same attitude, just act like nothing is strange at all, and it works out. I think if they do get pissy with each other, because I believe they may, just stay calm, ignore it, do like you did, try to distract with a toy or food. Looks good so far!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Oh god I know what you mean lol, my SO is the calm and collected one but every time they got near I'd tense up and cover my mouth. I really tried not to give off any bad vibes though.

I don't know though, I mean they seem to be OKAY with each other, definitely not ready to be alone yet, but it seems like Phoenix is just waiting to make his move and attack/kill her. I don't know why I get that vibe from him. I hope that's not the case!


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Yeah, it probably is too early to release them together then, if you are getting that vibe. And you can't do what you did.....sorry, I'm going to yell at you!!! LOL!!! You CAN NOT put your hand over your mouth and tense or freak....NO NO NO!!!! Take it from me, the Queen of freak outs, the spaz, it is the worst thing you can do!!! And then when we introduced Stephano and Taffy, now Steph was only 5 mos old (best guess) and Taffy was 5, but the only other interaction Taffy had with other cats was Beep beating the snot out of him, so he was very freaked having another kitty in his house suddenly. But I vowed, that no matter what happened, if Taffy went nuts on Steph or vise versa, I was just going to sit there and have no reaction. So Taffy was growling like crazy and hissing, but he made no move towards Steph, but Steph kept moving closer towards him. At one point he got with in a foot of him and just flopped down on his side and looked at him. A short time later, maybe half hour, Steph brushed up against the growling Taffy, and nothing happened, but Taffy did NOT want him touching him, so he kept backing away from him. Then, the most hysterical thing happened, Stephano pounced, playfully and took a running leap at Taffy and literally rolled him. It was all playfully, but Taffy gave this angry Mew and you could tell he was offended and insulted that this little nuisance had such nerve. But he did nothing to Stephano either. A few minutes later, Stephano rubbed up against Taffy again, and Taffy started grooming him. My heart MELTED!!! I could have cried! After having Beep and Taffy separated for FIVE YEARS, I finally had a cat that could be friends with Taffy. It was a great moment. I really hope yours goes well, but please don't be disappointed if it doesn't go that well, most cat intros do not go as well with full grown cats. It could take time, and there could be some scrapping between the two. But if you feel like you are going to react badly, then you go in the other room, close the door and let your SO be the one to be referee. Or will yourself to NOT react. I am so convinced that your reaction is so key, just like Marcia mentioned, act like it's no big deal, it's all cool. Looking back at Beep and Taffy's failed intro, I probably should have taken a valium before I started, LOL! I'm serious! 

A few more practice sessions, that's what I would do. In the meantime, give your first cat lots and lots of love and attention, let her know how much you love her and give her a special treat. That's what I would do anyway. 

Black kitties are the best! Stephano looks just like your kitties


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

OMG!!! Okay, no freaking out then lol I do NOT want to jinx this.


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## Cat Lover Lennie (Jan 7, 2013)

I think you are doing everything perfect! That growling/hissing will stop in a few days and then happen once in a blue moon. The fact that big brother is tolerating her so well says a lot. He's NOT aggressive, just curious. They may startle each other once in awhile but I think you have done an awesome job. There is no way they would hang around each other if they were not okay with the situation. Cats don't hide their feelings! The "noise" is just their initial conversations. Keep letting them around each other....bet you will find them napping together soon! I'm really happy for you. It is a wonderful thing when everybody gets along. They will have you howling with laughter soon with their antics......and when they start to play chase...DO NOT PANIC.....they love that game and they will both be very happy having a friend!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Awwww thank you, this really reassured me.

My mind is so weird, I was actually thinking that maybe Phoenix was doing the sleepy blink is because he wants to trick Luna into thinking he's Okay with her, so then she puts her guard down and he can pounce on her :???:


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## Mitts & Tess (Sep 4, 2004)

there is always going to be growling and hissing. They are getting use to each other. I think they did great. Marcia is right. Cats pick up on our energy. Stay calm and know what ever happens you can handle the situation. The only time Id get concerned if there is fur flying and puncture wounds. Other wise play therapy really works! 

I watched Jackson Gallaxy do separate playing of two cats (which wouldnt get along) in the same room. Feeding cats in the same room supervised so they get use to each other and realize food and happy times happen when the other cat is around. It works.

You are doing great in these supervised exposures.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

At this point I have no idea what's going on, they had another supervised visit. They can get closer to each other and coexist but Phoenix is always slowly walking up towards Luna and trying to sniff her, Luna keeps growling and hissing at Phoenix when he gets close and Phoenix has slapped her twice now and I've separated them. I don't know if this is a step backwards.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Nope, another session is what it was, and swipes are to be expected. Are they sniffing each other and checking each other out under the door? Remember, just ignore the hissy fits, because one is going to break out, and you have to let it go.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

howsefrau32 said:


> Nope, another session is what it was, and swipes are to be expected. Are they sniffing each other and checking each other out under the door? Remember, just ignore the hissy fits, because one is going to break out, and you have to let it go.


I don't think either of them are sniffing under the door. Phoenix was sniffing around there a few times when she first got here, but Luna hasn't. Phoenix doesn't bother sniffing the door anymore.

When Phoenix goes in Luna's room he sniffs around the litterbox and the room and tries to sniff Luna but it looks like Luna is scared and uninterested in sniffing back.

I'd give Luna something of Phoenix's to sniff like a blanket, but he doesn't sleep on those things, he just plops on the floor to sleep or sleeps in his cat tree (which I've shown her).


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Do you guys recommend getting a couple Feliaway plugins?

I think someone here suggested a Feliaway collar for Phoenix, but what about the Plugin?

What works better anyways?


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

If he doesn't sleep on blankets, you can use a towel and rub on Phoenix (where the scent glands are like his head) and put it where Luna sleeps...and vice versa!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

What I suspected is happening seems to be happening, that Phoenix was pretending to be nice only to get close to Luna to attack her.

He keeps slowly walking up her and she's hissing/growling and backing away, and Phoenix raises his paw up and smacks her multiple times and they both hiss.

This process is so slow x_x


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

Shhhhhhh relax. Deep breath. It's ok. It takes a while, and you're doing just fine. Give yourself a pat on the back and have some ice cream


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

JungliBillis said:


> Shhhhhhh relax. Deep breath. It's ok. It takes a while, and you're doing just fine. Give yourself a pat on the back and have some ice cream


How is it going fine if Phoenix is attacking her? :-? Now Luna trusts him even less now.


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## JungliBillis (Mar 20, 2013)

It's natural for the two cats to not get along in the beginning. This could take a few weeks or more, and it may get a little better, little worse, as you go. Important thing is to keep diligent and patient in the process in order for it to work. Site swapping, scent swapping, feeding, playing, positive associations, etc etc. I don't want you to get frustrated or nervous, as cats can sense that and may associate that with the other kitty!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Quick update.

Gave them 2 supervised visits today, Phoenix I think has stopped fearing Luna. He didn't hiss or growl at her. I think he knows he's the dominant one.

But this creates another problem. Now each time they meet........Phoenix stalks her relentlessly. He will slowly walk up towards her, sniffing....Luna will hiss/growl......Phoenix persists....and when he gets close enough, he tries to smack her and bite her.

Luna does NOT trust Phoenix anymore. I don't know how to progress from this. Luna is scared out of her wits. Even if Phoenix _did_ want to be nice and just sniff her, she would hiss/growl. So he kind of ruined everything by being a brat :fust

Tried to have play therapy with them but they were both too fixated on each other.

There were times when Phoenix would just lay there and play a little, but then remember Luna and be like "OOoo! A moving target! Much better than this toy I have!".

He even took a couple bites of her food and licked her water, the little jerk!

How do I progress from this?


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Poop, forgot to mention he actually tried to bite the kittens neck. 

Put a stop to that real quick. Don't want to even know what would happen if we let it progress.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Took a short video of it, they were acting worse the other day so maybe they are improving. Cats are weird lol.

YouTube


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

It's not showing your video, it says private and you have to log in.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

K I changed it to Public, you should be able to watch now.


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

that's really mild. honest. bad reactions are where there's that awful screaming sound and they're rolling around in a ball that looks like one cat and hair and blood is flying everywhere. you have two cats just working it out, and that little hop/pounce is playful. she will warm up to him and start playing when she figures out he isn't going to hurt her.

I just wouldn't leave them alone in the same room when you aren't there because if he for some reason does decide to actually try to hurt her, she will be terrified of him which will just exacerbate the situation. but as it is, he really doesn't look aggressive or like he wants to harm her. that's just how cats act when they're curious. he ain't mad at her. that would look a lot different.

keep supervising them for at least two more weeks, but they look fine. it can take cats up to six months to be fully used to each other, and it has taken three years for my younger two males to get to where they can actually play and sit on the bed with each other.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

cinderflower said:


> that's really mild. honest. bad reactions are where there's that awful screaming sound and they're rolling around in a ball that looks like one cat and hair and blood is flying everywhere. you have two cats just working it out, and that little hop/pounce is playful. she will warm up to him and start playing when she figures out he isn't going to hurt her.
> 
> I just wouldn't leave them alone in the same room when you aren't there because if he for some reason does decide to actually try to hurt her, she will be terrified of him which will just exacerbate the situation. but as it is, he really doesn't look aggressive or like he wants to harm her. that's just how cats act when they're curious. he ain't mad at her. that would look a lot different.
> 
> keep supervising them for at least two more weeks, but they look fine. it can take cats up to six months to be fully used to each other, and it has taken three years for my younger two males to get to where they can actually play and sit on the bed with each other.


Yeah I wouldn't leave them alone together yet. That video is mild. It gets loud and hissy (from Luna) when she backs herself into a corner and Phoenix goes after her. He tries to bite her, but I THINK he's maybe playing? Honestly I can't tell.

I've been trying to play with Da Bird with them both together, but when Luna plays, Phoenix gets so fixated on her that he'd rather chase her instead of the bird.

I know I'm making it into a bigger deal than it is. This is my first time having my own cat, let alone TWO cats lol. My childhood cats back at my parents house (whom both died 2 years ago at the age of 21) HATED each other their entire lives. Well actually one was pretty mellow, but the other would hiss every time the other cat came near and she didn't like people either......I'd hate to have a repeat of that. They both made each other miserable. You'd think living together all those years they would have worked it out somehow but they never did.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I captured this cute moment between them. Well, it was cute until Luna freaked out lol.

Cat Introduction 2 - YouTube


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Omg I'm about to explode from cuteness overload. They are laying next to each other and the kitten was actually grooming Phoenix!


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

YAY!!!!! So cute!!!! This is HUGE progress!!! And PROMISE ME, when they start to scrap with each other, and the fur flies on occasion, just INGORE it even if it KILLS YOU!!! LOL!!! Yes, I am yelling at you!!! DO NOT BE ME!!!!! I swear, I ruined Taffy and Beep ever being able to be out together, because I majorly flipped out when they would fight. I'm betting you are going to see some domination behavior too eventually. Taffy would stand on Stephano, bite his neck and not growl exaclty, but make noises, and I kind of freaked, but everyone said not to interfere unless there was blood. I would on occasion go over there and say "knock it off" and clap, but for the most part, I let them work it out and they are fine now. 

I think this is going to work!!!! But please, promise when they have their hissy fits, just call go about your business....I'm telling you, if you flip out over this, you will set them back. But I think it's going to be fine


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Yes, it's all good, for sure keep them separated when you are not there for a while. I did this with Stephano and Taffy, while Steph was still pretty little. Also, make sure that the kitten has a chance to use the litterbox without the big one bullying while she is trying.....this was a problem with Taffy and Stephano, Stephano actually goes up and bothers Taffy when he is trying to use it, so I kind of had to make sure in the beginning that that was not happening, because then they wills start having litter box problems. 

It's all going WAY better than most cat intros go, for sure!


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

howsefrau32 said:


> YAY!!!!! So cute!!!! This is HUGE progress!!! And PROMISE ME, when they start to scrap with each other, and the fur flies on occasion, just INGORE it even if it KILLS YOU!!! LOL!!! Yes, I am yelling at you!!! DO NOT BE ME!!!!! I swear, I ruined Taffy and Beep ever being able to be out together, because I majorly flipped out when they would fight. I'm betting you are going to see some domination behavior too eventually. Taffy would stand on Stephano, bite his neck and not growl exaclty, but make noises, and I kind of freaked, but everyone said not to interfere unless there was blood. I would on occasion go over there and say "knock it off" and clap, but for the most part, I let them work it out and they are fine now.
> 
> I think this is going to work!!!! But please, promise when they have their hissy fits, just call go about your business....I'm telling you, if you flip out over this, you will set them back. But I think it's going to be fine


LOL I PROMISE! They've had scraps....kinda, if you count Phoenix stalking Luna into a corner or box until she hisses a scrap, lol, he likes chasing her around. I haven't interfered unless she goes behind the couch and is trapped.


I have a question for the future, when they start getting along more and settled in and start eating together.......how do I stop them from sharing each others food? Like Phoenix is already going in Luna's room and eating her food. What will happen when the bowls are next to each other? I don't want Luna to starve because Phoenix eats it all lol and I can't stand there and watch them finish everything. He's also pooped in her litter box a few times now lol, don't know if that's anything.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I think Phoenix's biting habit is rubbing off on Luna because now she's biting me x_x


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Awww, I missed this yesterday, I love the picture! See, they will be ok! Even if they are little buttheads to each other once in a while....mine are. Just today Stephano ran at Taffy and rolled him around on the ground and they were biting each other, making not quite growling noises, but little annoyed noises at each other. I just ignore it, or say "knock it off" once in a while, but I let them work it out. 

I have to put Stephano up when he eats. He is a little piglet, and he will eat his food in about 1 minute and then rush over to not only eat Taffy's food (Taffy eats the speed of a 90 year old man), but he will also try to eat my doberman's food too.....yep! He is fearless. So Stephano's butt gets put in the den with the door closed until everyone else finishes. We feed 3 meals a day, wet food, we do not free feed dry, if that is your issue, I don't know how you will stop your cat from eating the other ones food. You should consider feeding meals, then they will be hungry and eat all of their food.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Dunno what you mean by meals. I feed Phoenix 1/3 cup dry food twice a day. His bowl is almost never empty when I fill it again. He doesn't come to me for food like he's hungry.

I've been kind of free feeding Luna for now. Haven't been paying attention to the amount.


I have a question though, I feel kinda bad for Luna. She isn't getting a break. Phoenix chases her relentlessly and tries to bite her neck and get on top of her, this causes a hissy fit from Luna. Phoenix won't even let her eat so I have to separate them and put her back in her room. It's like Luna is just a toy for Phoenix. Is this normal? I mean I wouldn't be worried if they were both chasing each other, but it's just Phoenix doing the chasing and Luna doesn't seem to like it if she keeps hissing.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Visits aren't going too well today.

When they both aren't sleeping, Phoenix chases after her relentlessly. She can't do anything else. He won't let her eat or use the litterbox. All he wants to do is chase her and bite her neck and dominate her.

I don't think it's fun for her, she hisses and screeches and tries to get away.

It's like Luna is just a toy for Phoenix. 

I try to get them to play with wand toys but Phoenix is too fixated on her.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

Then continue to have play sessions, and then put them in separate rooms. Luna has to be able to use the litterbox without the little turkey hounding her there. We had the same problem with Stephano. I feed Stephano separate from Taffy, otherwise he will eat his food real fast and then eat Taffy's. So Steph goes in his room to eat, and doesn't come out until Taffy is done. This is good, because Stephano usually uses the litter box right after he eats in the morning, so he has time to do that, then he comes out of the room, and Taffy goes in to do his thing. 

I think it's all really new and exciting to them, so Phoenix is fixated on her at the moment, but they hopefully will get to the point where they will both want to go sleep elsewhere. But I guess for now, if he is relentless, as you say, then maybe put Luna up for a while, if she is wanting to go rest, and let him run it off away from her for a while. I gave Taffy breaks ALL the time. In fact, even now, if I leave for a while, I will sometimes put Stephano in the den by himself to give Taffy a break. He is almost a year old and still a bit annoying to Taffy. So give Luna breaks from him, but continue to let them have time together.


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

you can't keep them out of each other's food unless you stand there or lock one in a different room. meal times have become incredibly tedious for me but that's just how it is. when I only had two cats, they would switch at a certain point and trade dishes, even though they were eating exactly the same thing.

as far as him chasing her around, he'll get tired of it. plus they'll work out who the dominant one is, and my money's on him. just keep putting them together for a little while every day, otherwise luna will remain fascinating to phoenix if he never sees her. one month, two months, three months, you just never know but they're already getting along pretty well for new housemates so it shouldn't be that long. I just wouldn't leave them alone together until they've mostly worked it out. usually at the point they start grooming each other is when it relaxes.

i'd put him in a room with the door shut sometimes so she can have the run of the house, then alternate.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Thanks guys for the suggestions. 

I bought a lidded litter box for Luna with a flap, but guess what, she likes to go in there now and play "Catch my paw" with Phoenix. Oh lord lol.


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## 10cats2dogs (Jun 16, 2013)

ROFL ! Cats. Darned if you do , darned if you don't! But how we love them!

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

7cats2dogs said:


> ROFL ! Cats. Darned if you do , darned if you don't! But how we love them!
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


So true! lol :luv


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## Cat Lover Lennie (Jan 7, 2013)

Auroraei said:


> Visits aren't going too well today.
> 
> When they both aren't sleeping, Phoenix chases after her relentlessly. She can't do anything else. He won't let her eat or use the litterbox. All he wants to do is chase her and bite her neck and dominate her.
> 
> ...


Luna hasn't been fixed yet, right? That's why he is trying to bite her neck...she smells delicious in his world and he would like to mate. That's how they mate by the way. The male grabs the female by the neck to hold her in place. All perfectly normal. When I still had Pepper (all black) 
he would try to mount Katy-Did daily. They were both fixed already but that didn't stop old Pepper. He didn't know what he was doing so he would grab her neck and try to mount (he was at least 3x her size) and she would wiggle out, hiss and sometimes smack him.
You are really blessed and you don't even know it yet! The videos of them interacting are awesome. He may be trying to be dominant but she is holding her own. She is NOT freaking out and she is not afraid....she just waltzes away. A scared cat acts scared. In the window sill video, if you watch closely, Luna tolerates his attention for awhile and then it starts annoying her. You can tell when she's had enough because she starts swishing her tail. She can totally handle him on her own. They aren't fighting....he wants to play....she's not sure how yet. Roll a ball for them both to chase or some wadded up aluminum foil. I think it was in the window sill video that after she put him in his place, he came back in with his head lowered, a sign of submission. What you call a freak out is normal cat interaction. I'm sorry but YOU are the only one freaking! They are doing GREAT! :jump


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## Cat Lover Lennie (Jan 7, 2013)

My 4 all trade out feeding bowls....with wet food, 2 only lick off the gravy, 2 will actually eat some. I scoop it all into one bowl once they have scattered and they always wander back, one at a time and snack until its gone. For dry food, they are still both kittens so they can eat the same thing. My 11 yr old liked the kitten food! What are you going to do? Him using her litterbox is no problem..to them, a litterbox is a litterbox. I have 4 litterboxes, 2 in the bathroom and 2 in the laundry room. The bathroom boxes get the most use. I don't know who starts it but usually all the poop is in one box and all the pee in the other....next day they'll switch which one is for poop and which one is for pee.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Cat Lover Lennie said:


> My 4 all trade out feeding bowls....with wet food, 2 only lick off the gravy, 2 will actually eat some. I scoop it all into one bowl once they have scattered and they always wander back, one at a time and snack until its gone. For dry food, they are still both kittens so they can eat the same thing. My 11 yr old liked the kitten food! What are you going to do? Him using her litterbox is no problem..to them, a litterbox is a litterbox. I have 4 litterboxes, 2 in the bathroom and 2 in the laundry room. The bathroom boxes get the most use. I don't know who starts it but usually all the poop is in one box and all the pee in the other....next day they'll switch which one is for poop and which one is for pee.


Awwwwwwww so cute!!!!!!! lol I just don't want Luna hiding in there. Ewww!

Good to know about the litterbox, that "a litterbox is a litterbox", I would have thought that since they peed/pooped in it, that they were claiming that it's their territory. So I thought Phoenix using hers was a way of trying to claim it.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I think Luna might still have earmites. Her ears look dirty inside even though they cleaned them out. If so, wtf was the Ivermectin and Revolution for?!

Oh and another thing, today she keeps going in her litterbox and squatting like she has to use it, but nothing happens and she leaves. She isn't crying or anything.

i swear if it's not one thing, it's another. She drinks plenty of water so I don't know what the problem is.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Phoenix isn't bothering her when she goes in there so I don't know what it is.


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

If she is going into her litter box to pee and nothing is happening, she needs to see a vet. That is a sign of a UTI, or crystals or blockage, and that is dangerous. I realize it is Sunday, but I would be getting her to the vet ASAP in the morning. I think if she is having issues like this, it would be best to keep her separated form Phoenix until you can get her to the vet, just so she can relax and not be worried about him bothering her, and maybe she can rest. I can't remember, what kind of diet does she eat? If she does have any kind of urinary issue, wet food is best for her, to get as much water as possible into her.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

howsefrau32 said:


> If she is going into her litter box to pee and nothing is happening, she needs to see a vet. That is a sign of a UTI, or crystals or blockage, and that is dangerous. I realize it is Sunday, but I would be getting her to the vet ASAP in the morning. I think if she is having issues like this, it would be best to keep her separated form Phoenix until you can get her to the vet, just so she can relax and not be worried about him bothering her, and maybe she can rest. I can't remember, what kind of diet does she eat? If she does have any kind of urinary issue, wet food is best for her, to get as much water as possible into her.


That's the thing, I don't know why she's going in there. is she trying to pee? Is she trying to poop? Does she just think it's fun in there? I found pee balls this morning in her litterbox.

She's been eating dry food but I've seen her drink a ton of water each day and twice (2 separate days) I fed both Phoenix and Luna half a can of tuna with extra water as a treat so I have a hard time believing she's not getting enough liquid :\


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

How big were the pee clumps in her litter box? Were the pretty big or small? no matter how much water they are drinking with dry food, it still does not compare to what they are getting with a wet food diet. I would recommend you read this website Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition :: healthy cat diet, making cat food, litter box, cat food, cat nutrition, cat urinary tract health it explains about why wet food is better for cats. A diet of just dry food does not give cats enough water in their diet. Also, tuna is probably fine once in a while, but is not a good choice to give cats on a regular basis either. You can read about this on the above link. I have been through this **** of UTI's and crystals when my boy cat was on an all dry food diet, and thousands of dollars later and him almost dying, I switched him and all my cats to wet food. 

You need to get Luna to the vet tomorrow, to rule out crystals or urinary issues. This is what cats do frequently when they have urinary issues, they go to the litter box over and over and nothing happens. They don't always cry, so just because she is not crying does not mean she is in pain. You need to get her in tomorrow, or an ER vet if she is not peeing at all. Put her in a room by herself with a clean litter box and see if she is making any pee at all, if she's not, that is an emergency. I can't stress that enough.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Okay I will keep an eye on it. 

I had Phoenix on dry food (Halo and Blue Buffalo) because he won't eat wet. I've tried so many different brands, different types, pate, grilled, sliced, chopped.............all he would do is lick the broth and leave the meat. Then I found a brand of dry he liked and bought a Drinkwell fountain. He's been doing fine. I don't know why Luna is having this issue all the sudden.

I will confine her too the room with her litterbox and if she hasn't peed by tomorrow I'll rush her to the vet.

Also, the tuna was just a treat. I wanted to see if they'd eat together (they would). Isn't that something? Phoenix will eat canned tuna but won't touch any other wet food. GRR!


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## howsefrau32 (Mar 6, 2013)

You can get some advice on how to convert them to wet food, it is not easy, but it can be done IF you do what is recommended, but see what happens tomorrow and if she needs the vet. I know how frustrating it is to feed wet when they won't eat the canned food, but the fact that your cats WILL lick the gravy and leave the meat......they are going to be WAY easier to convert than most cats, because many won't even do that. But the most important thing is you CAN NOT leave dry food out for them to eat all the time, if you do that, they are always going to pick that over the canned food. I hope you will read the Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition :: healthy cat diet, making cat food, litter box, cat food, cat nutrition, cat urinary tract health website, really read it, because it will all make sense to you as to why it is better, not just because I'm telling you or other people on this board will tell you. And there are people here that will tell you that people like me are crazy and that it makes no difference, but MANY vets and cat owners strongly believe that it does make a HUGE difference. For me, it was a simple as offering a small amount, like 1/4 cup of dry in the morning, and then offer wet. Leave it out. Let it sit. Then they get another 1/4 cup of dry in the evening, and more wet food. After a few days of this, they will get hungry enough to eat the wet food, more than just lick it. But if they have kibble offered 24/7.....you will never win this battle in getting them to eat wet food. 

Anyway, more of that later. I hope all is well with Luna in the morning, I will be anxious to hear how she is doing. Hugs, I know you are worried about her, you are a good cat momma


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

She did 2 medium sized pee balls this morning. I also took away her dry food and bought her some wet (she didn't finish it all). Butttttttttt no poop, so maybe she never had a UTI? Maybe she can't poop? If so.......how can I help her do that?

Also, if I need to get my cats on a wet diet, not to sound uncaring since it was my decision to take in 2 cats, but how will I afford it? I don't want to feed them a crappy brand, but canned food is really expensive.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

Like for instance if I wanted to buy Blue Buffalo canned food, that's like $80 a month! How does anyone afford that?


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## molldee (May 19, 2013)

Everyone says cheap wet food is better than any dry food. Friskies can food is pretty cheap !


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

molldee said:


> Everyone says cheap wet food is better than any dry food. Friskies can food is pretty cheap !


Is that true? I have a hard time believing that.


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## cinderflower (Apr 22, 2012)

depends on who you talk to. it's because of the moisture content. canned = about 78%. dry = <10%.

it's the ingredients that change but that could be debated all day.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

cinderflower said:


> depends on who you talk to. it's because of the moisture content. canned = about 78%. dry = <10%.
> 
> it's the ingredients that change but that could be debated all day.


I just really don't want to go through this again, trying to find a food they will eat. I gave up on Phoenix when I went through millions of different brands, he wouldn't even eat raw. Every type of wet he'd just lick up the broth and leave the rest.

Sooooooooooo frustrating.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

It IS true that even the cheapest canned is better for your cat than the most expensive kibble. It's all about hydration. Cats don't have enough of a thirst drive to make up the HUGE moisture deficit in kibble compared to canned food, so kibble-fed cats end up being chronically dehydrated. This can have all sorts of devastating effects, both short and long term, on a cat's physical body. Your cat will be healthier if you switch him to canned food - ANY canned food. 

Go to coupon clipping websites and check them regularly for pet food coupons. Go to pet food manufacturer websites and check for coupons there. Go to online pet food sellers like Doggiefood.com - Dog, Cat, & Pet Food, Treats, Food & Supplies - Free Shipping and Petflow | Pet Food Delivery! and sign up for their mailing lists so that you can be notified of their sales and promotions. Even not on sale, these sites often sell pet foods for less than you can buy them at brick and mortar stores, and if you buy at least $40-50 worth at a time, shipping is free on some sites. ALWAYS do a Google search for discount coupon codes before buying ANYTHING online.

Laurie


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

BTW, if you have a cat who likes broth but won't eat the rest of the food, try pureeing the food in a kitchen blender with enough hot water to make it a thick gravy texture that he can lap up. The blender will incorporate the water fully so that he can't just lick the juice and leave the rest. He'll automatically get food and water with every lick.

Laurie


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

But doesn't cheap cat food have like byproducts and grains and all this bad stuff that everyone says not to feed your cats?

I feel like a crappy pet owner for having to downgrading them. I really wish I could spend $80 a month on cat food lol.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I personally don't believe that by-products are anywhere near as bad as so many people make them out to be. After all, the natural feline diet includes all or most of the prey animals' by-products. As far as grains and other carb sources are concerned, you'll find a LOT more of those in any kibble than you will in any canned food. Even the "grain-free" kibbles are typically loaded with fruit and veggie carbs that cats should not be eating in any significant amounts. So don't fret about low-quality canned foods. If that's what you can afford, you should still feel good about upgrading your cat's diet if you're feeding that instead of kibble.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

laurief said:


> I personally don't believe that by-products are anywhere near as bad as so many people make them out to be. After all, the natural feline diet includes all or most of the prey animals' by-products. As far as grains and other carb sources are concerned, you'll find a LOT more of those in any kibble than you will in any canned food. Even the "grain-free" kibbles are typically loaded with fruit and veggie carbs that cats should not be eating in any significant amounts. So don't fret about low-quality canned foods. If that's what you can afford, you should still feel good about upgrading your cat's diet if you're feeding that instead of kibble.


Yeah true I don't believe the hype around how byproducts are bad either. I highly doubt in the wild that a cat would refuse to eat part of an animal.


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## Auroraei (Jun 18, 2013)

I feel bad for Phoenix. He doesn't want to play anymore. He just sits there while Luna plays. I try playing with them with Da Bird and Luna goes nuts for it and Phoenix sits there watching her.

I put Luna in her room and then Phoenix got more into it.

I don't know why he's being like this  I give him more attention than Luna.


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## Cat Lover Lennie (Jan 7, 2013)

Patience! For awhile he will just want to watch her. My oldest cat does nothing BUT watch! That's okay.....he isn't feeling left out....just taking it all in.


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