# de-worming



## Whaler (Feb 13, 2011)

one of my guys has a moderately bad tapeworm infestation, and in the past i have used panacur-c on my crew for worms. the main issue with trying to use panacur again is that; 1) i used it on them twice in the past 6 months so i question the efficacy of it if i "go to the well" again and, 2) with it getting rather cold (10-15 degrees F tonight) their canned food gets nearly frozen quickly, so i worry about the panacur since they need to eat all of it for three straight days.

since it is a topical that i could easily apply to bootsie (the one with pretty bad tapeworm) i was thinking about ordering some profender but i read about a small percent of cats that have had pretty bad adverse reactions to it. my vet used it on pretty girl (my socialized feral) a while back but i feel that that was different since i could closely monitor her for any problems. have any of you guys ever used it on members of your colony? am i just being too much of a worry-wart daddy?


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## lyle (Oct 28, 2010)

I don't have any advice, but I have a question. How do you know/diagnose something like tapeworm in a feral colony? I wonder/worry sometimes that I will miss something because I can't get the ferals to cooperate with visits to the vet for checkups.

Not to make light of your medical problems. It seems that everything is a bit more serious when dealing with ferals and I wish you (and the cat) well. But I remember an old story about curing tapeworms in humans using 4 apples, 3 cookies and a hammer.


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## Lineth (Apr 12, 2011)

*Take him to a vet..*

My vet has de-wormed both of my cats for 40 dollars each. He gives them shots..and now they are healthy because no worms come out of my blackie butt..take him in first shot and then two weeks later the second shot. For deworming it is better to take them to the vet for shots.


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## Lineth (Apr 12, 2011)

*NO way to tell*



lyle said:


> I don't have any advice, but I have a question. How do you know/diagnose something like tapeworm in a feral colony? I wonder/worry sometimes that I will miss something because I can't get the ferals to cooperate with visits to the vet for checkups.
> 
> Not to make light of your medical problems. It seems that everything is a bit more serious when dealing with ferals and I wish you (and the cat) well. But I remember an old story about curing tapeworms in humans using 4 apples, 3 cookies and a hammer.


I don't know how to help you on this one because I think it is hard to tell. I can't because the ferals that I feed won't let me get near them. They see me and run for their lives...


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## Whaler (Feb 13, 2011)

lyle said:


> I don't have any advice, but I have a question. How do you know/diagnose something like tapeworm in a feral colony? I wonder/worry sometimes that I will miss something because I can't get the ferals to cooperate with visits to the vet for checkups.
> 
> Not to make light of your medical problems. It seems that everything is a bit more serious when dealing with ferals and I wish you (and the cat) well. But I remember an old story about curing tapeworms in humans using 4 apples, 3 cookies and a hammer.


in this case it is easy to diagnose the tapeworm issue with bootsie. i can frequently spot the rice like segments of the tapeworm in the fur near his anus. i have even taken a piece of two off his fur just to confirm that it was not some sort of dirt or debris that looked like tapeworm.

as far as other types of worms go i am certain that they get them frequently. the reasons i am sure are; 1) fleas, and 2) they are very good at catching mice. while i have started to address the flea issue by administering revolution to the three that will let me there is nothing i can do about their hunting. they are fed as much food as they can eat but they are cats. i just wish that they wouldn't leave me their presents so close to the back steps of my job. there are only so many dead mice that i wish to see and they have exceeded that number by like 100.

thanks for the warm wishes, it is appreciated.


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## Whaler (Feb 13, 2011)

Lineth said:


> My vet has de-wormed both of my cats for 40 dollars each. He gives them shots..and now they are healthy because no worms come out of my blackie butt..take him in first shot and then two weeks later the second shot. For deworming it is better to take them to the vet for shots.


in theory i would love to do just that but it just isn't feasible to do in my scenario. to trap them all again would be problematic at best, one or two of them wouldn't be a problem to trap but there is no way i could get them all. 

i have consulted with my vet in the past and they did recommend using the panacur-c, especially since the cats do not detect it in the food and it does take care of all of the worms, including tapeworm. like i said in the original post, i have had great luck with panacur it is just the issues that i mentioned.


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## Nora B (Nov 6, 2010)

I don't know how feasable it might be but have you considered heated bowls for the canned food? Pet stores, Farm & Fleet, etc. all sell a variety of both heated bowls and mats that may keep the food from freezing?
Just my based thought based on what you have described..


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## Whaler (Feb 13, 2011)

Nora B said:


> I don't know how feasable it might be but have you considered heated bowls for the canned food? Pet stores, Farm & Fleet, etc. all sell a variety of both heated bowls and mats that may keep the food from freezing?
> Just my based thought based on what you have described..


thanks for the input.

i had thought about the heated bowls but i don't have an outlet that i could use to plug them into, the colony is located behind my work and i can not run a cord outside since that would mean leaving the back door opened a crack.

the problem is solved though. i spoke with the head of the local shelter today and she is going to drop off a dose of profender as well as some dontral. i am going to try to use a pill pocket and see if i can get bootsie to eat it. if not, i will give him the dose of profender.

i will keep my fingers crossed that he goes for the pill pocket since i would feel more safe with that than with the profender.


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## BotanyBlack (Apr 6, 2011)

not sure if you have considered it but have you tried FOOD GRADE diatomaceous earth?

Food grade diatomaceous earth works in a purely physical/mechanical manner, not "chemical" and thus has no chemical toxicity. Best yet, parasites don’t build up a tolerance/immunity to its chemical reaction, so rotation of wormers is unnecessary. It is NOT a poison.

just dust it lightly over (or mix it in) the food. It does not build up in the body so can be used on a daily basis if given in light amounts. It will also add trace minerals that will make the feral healthier and coats shinier as a bonus. I wouldn't give give it to dehydrated animals and keep plenty of water available.

Daily recommended food grade diatomaceous earth feeding rates:

Kittens - 1/2 teaspoon 
Cats - 1 teaspoon 
Puppies - 1/2 to 1 tsp. 
Dogs under 35 lbs. - 1 teaspoon 
Dogs over 35 lbs. - 1 tablespoon 
Dogs over 100 lbs. - 2 tablespoons


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## Whaler (Feb 13, 2011)

BotanyBlack said:


> not sure if you have considered it but have you tried FOOD GRADE diatomaceous earth?
> 
> Food grade diatomaceous earth works in a purely physical/mechanical manner, not "chemical" and thus has no chemical toxicity. Best yet, parasites don’t build up a tolerance/immunity to its chemical reaction, so rotation of wormers is unnecessary. It is NOT a poison.
> 
> ...


i was considering it for treatment once the warmer weather returns. with the cold weather taking over it is problematic to do any food based treatments since the canned food starts to freeze quickly at their feeding times - 7:00 am and between 5:00 and 7:00 pm.

i just got two rounds of dontral today. i gave him a pill pocket with no pill in it yesterday and he gobbled it right up so tomorrow i will (hopefully) be able to get him to take the first round with the help of a pill pocket.


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## Whaler (Feb 13, 2011)

i tried to put the crushed dontral in his food but after a couple of bites he was on to my ploy and just sat there staring at me, refusing to eat any more. i tried putting it in his food since i would need him to eat three pill pockets, i can't get more than a half pill into a pocket.

well, pill pockets seem to be the magic i needed. after the failure of getting him to eat it after putting it in the food there was no problem getting him to gobble the pockets and get his meds. i just hope that in two weeks when i am trying to give him his next round it goes just a smooth.


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## Nora B (Nov 6, 2010)

That's awesome - hooray for pill pockets and a great big thumbs up or fist bump or whatever it is my kids are doing these days when thing rock out so well!

When I was a kid in the early eighties there was a group of cats I cared for outside. They were technically my stepsisters but since they weren't allowed in the house, and I was only around on weekends I worried about them alot in Chicago's winters - hence we built a cat house - not suggesting this just getting to a potentially worthwhile thought the long way around. foam board - I like the extruded 2 inch thick home insulation type that comes in 4 X 8 foot sheets is awesome stuff. easy to glue and carve - cheap and we use to build insulated food holders out of them to keep the water up off the ground so it would take longer to freeze - kind of like if you had enough snow to plop the bowls down in the water wouldn't freeze but on the ground - straight up ice cubes in a short time. Anyway just an idea if you need a non electric inexpensive insulated feeder sort of thing - shoot you could go all out and microwave a disposable gel pack to stick underneath to get some extra hours out of it - never mind I think I just took a simple kind deed way to far out into project land.

congrats on getting the drontal in - it does work really well on the tapeworms - nasty things that they are.


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