# Pure breed or not?



## felis (Feb 25, 2005)

I've always been wondering about something: isn't the point of pure breeds that you breed them with the same breed (Persian with Persian). So how can a cat that is a mixure of two breeds still be a pure breed? Example Snowshoe is a mix of two breeds (Siamese & American Shorthair) yet she is recognized as a pure breed.
I hope I wasn't too unclear and that someone will have an answer. Thanx everyone! :catsm


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## Nero the Sable (Oct 28, 2004)

Sometimes when they are making a new breed of cat - they sometimes mix two breeds together until they can get the same style (that's a bad word) and personality kitten each time.

My cats are Himalayans - Siamese and Persian bred together for the look of a Persian but have the color points of a Siamese.

Himalayans are calm and purr all the time like Persians - but they talk a lot like Siamese cats do.

Pretty much when they breed them together - they are trying to make a new cat and have other people working with them and helping them start a breeding program to get these new cats off the ground.

I'm sure someone else can explain it better than I can. :lol:


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## coaster (Dec 1, 2004)

To elaborate on that, a mix isn't a purebred until it's recognized as a new breed by an established organization.


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## Sol (Feb 20, 2003)

I can only speak for "my" breed, Devon Rex, but we regulary outcross with other breeds in order to expand the genepool and maintain good health of the breed. First of all we have to get permission from out organisation (in my case from SVERAK/FIFé). If we breed a Devon Rex with an European Shorthait the offspring will be registered as a DRX/EUR-cross NOT as a purebred. This is done with other breeds to.


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## Kittenofyourheart (Feb 20, 2005)

I m not being rude by saying thi so please dont take this in anyways but sarcastic...... THE ONLY FULL BREED MIX BREED ANIMAL IVE EVR HAD IS CALLED A HEINZ 57......... AND I LOVE EVERY ONE OF EM...!!!!! HE HE HE


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## Zalensia (Aug 25, 2003)

heinz 57, only the best


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## Jeanie (Jun 18, 2003)

Yes, people do create new breeds. It takes four or five generation of breeding true to the new breed before it is recognized in the US. Proof has to be offered, and strict records submitted to a recognized organization. Then the decision is made. It takes years. Some breeds, such as Munchkins, may be recognized, but a certain percentage of the kittens will have normal legs. I assume this is an exception.

This is not a forum for people to make sarcastic remarks about pure bred animals. If you don't approve of them, please don't post here. It's unkind and disrespectful. This forum is tor the education and discussion of breeding. In fact, I recommend that a sticky be posted to that effect, and that Sol delete or move to review all posts from people who come here to criticize breeders and registered cats.

Most breeders have rescued or owned many domestic cats and love them. (moggies)


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## vanillasugar (Nov 11, 2004)

NewRagdoll said:


> felis said:
> 
> 
> > I've always been wondering about something: isn't the point of pure breeds that you breed them with the same breed (Persian with Persian). So how can a cat that is a mixure of two breeds still be a pure breed? Example Snowshoe is a mix of two breeds (Siamese & American Shorthair) yet she is recognized as a pure breed.
> ...


I believe felis was speaking of Snowshoe the breed, not the name of an individual cat. It's a hybrid breed to my knowledge...


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## Kittenofyourheart (Feb 20, 2005)

peppermint andI are fighting over the keyboard.... shes wanting type something.. Anyways.... as I was saying.... silly kitty... breeding whether it be pure or mixed or a heinz 57..... I see no where that it says I cant talk about my babies being a hienz57.... and I cant believ that anyone could be offended by the remark I made previosly BUT if any one was offended I apologize. BUT my cats breeds in my opinion are just that a hienz 57! so, I find it disrepectful for some one to imply my casual humor as being rude and uncalled for ina breeding topic. When I know for a fact half the cats out there are hienz57 or as most call it mixed. I find it to be on topic and with positive humor. now if there are no objections I do have a breeding question. Can anyone define to me exactly what a tabby cat is? Ive been told peppermint is Tabby or colico ( sorry cant spell).... Im going to try and post a picture soon. but anyone who could expain the difference between the two. Id appreciate it. thanks


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## Jeanie (Jun 18, 2003)

Tabby is the pattern of three of the many domestic cats I have raised. It's not wise to breed tabbies, because of the overabundance of DSH cats in shelters. It is not a breed.


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## Kittenofyourheart (Feb 20, 2005)

I am not interested inbreeding my cats as much as finding information on their history. Unfortunately to live on a military post I had to get them fixed. I wish I hadnt because I kinda feel like Im playing GOD. I realize the good and bad things that come with getting an animal fixed. I would love to post a picture of my cat here so you guys might be able to tell me some physical traits my kitties may have a pure breds..... he he he kinda like geneology fr the kitties... If there are no objects please let me know and Ill post a picture... thanks


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## Nero the Sable (Oct 28, 2004)

Kittenofyourheart said:


> I am not interested inbreeding my cats as much as finding information on their history. Unfortunately to live on a military post I had to get them fixed. I wish I hadnt because I kinda feel like Im playing GOD. I realize the good and bad things that come with getting an animal fixed. I would love to post a picture of my cat here so you guys might be able to tell me some physical traits my kitties may have a pure breds..... he he he kinda like geneology fr the kitties... If there are no objects please let me know and Ill post a picture... thanks


It's probably good that you are anyway - because if a girl goes into heat it will probably drive you crazy. Not to mention the cancer and everything else. :lol: Then again - you have to do it anyway - it's a military base after all. Does your father in the military or is it your husband? (I don't know your age)

Love that kitty to pieces!


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## Jeanie (Jun 18, 2003)

Calico Cat, three colors, not a pure bred cat.


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## Kittenofyourheart (Feb 20, 2005)

my husband is in the Army... lol Im 21.... and I had te pleasure of being driven up the wall by trixie.... lol... she went into heat before I could get her fixed ( money wise) and she drove us coo coo lol


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## soph0127 (Mar 6, 2005)

Jeanie said:


> Tabby is the pattern of three of the many domestic cats I have raised. It's not wise to breed tabbies, because of the overabundance of DSH cats in shelters. It is not a breed.


I'm not quite sure what you getting at about the tabby not being a breed. I have a Blue tabby persian, who has it's own division among the persians. Classic Tabby, MacTabby, and Mackerel tabbies are all in divisions among persians.


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## Jeanie (Jun 18, 2003)

The young lady didn't ask about varieties of Persian Cats. If she has a variety of a Persian Cat, I'm sure she'd know if she had a pure bred cat. There are thousands of DSH and DLH Tabbies and they are identified only as Tabbies. I think we would have received a reply telling us that the picture I posted was not the type of tabby whe was speaking of. 

That's what I was "getting at." Did you think I was misleading her? That's not my style. I am a former breeder. If someone says seal point, should I assume that the cat is a Himalayan? My seal point is a Siamese. Seal point is a description of markings, just as tabby is. Seal Point is not a breed.

Webster's Dictionary defines tabby:

Main Entry: 1tab·by 
Pronunciation: 'ta-bE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural tabbies
Etymology: French tabis, from Medieval Latin attabi, from Arabic 'attAbI, from Al-'AttAbIya, quarter in Baghdad
1 a archaic : a plain silk taffeta especially with moiré finish b : a plain-woven fabric
2 [2tabby] a : a domestic cat with a striped and mottled coat b : a domestic cat; especially : a female cat 
[


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## coaster (Dec 1, 2004)

Seems to be the usual confusion between breed - color - and pattern.









Did Webster breed cats? :wink: 

I'm sure Jeanie knows more than Webster about these definitions.


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## Sol (Feb 20, 2003)

soph0127 said:


> Jeanie said:
> 
> 
> > Tabby is the pattern of three of the many domestic cats I have raised. It's not wise to breed tabbies, because of the overabundance of DSH cats in shelters. It is not a breed.
> ...


I have to agree with Jeanie on this one. Tabby is not a breed, it's a color/marking BUT some breeds, such as Persians, are grouped by color/markings. However, it's not correct to say that tabby is a breed.

There are Tabby Persians, Tabby Devon Rexes, Tabby Domestic Shorthairs, all are tabbies but the sure aren't the same breed.


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