# Cat adoption process... seriously??



## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

I have some mixed emotions about getting a kitten from adoption center... I know many will not agree with me, but hear me out. 

In order to get a cat from an adoption center, I need to fill out application. I am asked how often I travel, what brand of food and kitty litter I will be using (SERIOUSLY? I absolutely have to use the most expensive food to my cats?), how many hours I am away at work (and if I will be getting the most expensive food, I need to work a lot), where I live, when and where I plan to move.. I will then have an interview, a home visit, and someone will speak to my landlord....
I understand the good intentions behind this whole process, but...

To tell you the truth, this is a drag  And intrusive. And, to be fair, this is more difficult than having a baby human. Nobody denies a mom a privilege of having a baby if she plans to feed chinese takeout and macdonalds...

It is much easier to get a cat from craigslist, and I bet most people would turn away in the middle of filling out this application, realizing that now they will have to let a stranger into their house, and prove to someone that they will treat a kitten well. They will go to craigslist, get a kitten there, encourage backyard breeders to breed more, and the unadopted cats will remain not adopted.

It is also interesting, that getting a cat from an adoption agency is more expensive, more intrusive, longer... I bet more decent people would adopt cats if the process was easier, less cats would be on the streets, less encouragement and money would go to backyard breeders. I feel that such measures to solve a cat population and abandonment problem might actually make the problem worse.

And while I did complete my application, and if the shelter finds a good match for me I will adopt from them, there is a high chance that many decent people will not just because many people value their privacy and prefer not to be evaluated by other people....


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## grrawritsjordi (Dec 29, 2012)

My adoption process was similar, but not as extensive. Our shelter told us the type of food we should feed them, recommended a vet and did come into our home to check it out. They wanted to make sure everything was okay (we weren't hoarders, dirty, ect.). The lady came in and took a look around and stayed all of 15 minutes just showing us all the things we would need to watch out for. I actually liked her coming in and showing me things that I didn't think about.

They didn't need to talk to the landlord and the application took all of 5 minutes to fill out, although it may have taken longer because I kept on loving on my Moosey the whole time. The adoption fee was $145, which I thought was a little steep as I just adopted a cat over the summer for my sister for $50, but that was back in Indiana and this is Los Angeles...

Honestly, if you don't think this is going to be right for you, go to a different shelter and find another place that isn't so intrusive. At first I was very upset as Moosey was not what I expected her to be, but she has since gotten used to us and is affectionate and can be very sweet. (She spent 9 months in the shelter due to missing most of her ear).

Good luck!


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

Did they actually _say_ you have to use the most expensive cat food, or are you just assuming?

I ask because typically that question would be just to make sure that 1.) you're feeding a diet that has _some_ nutritional value, and 2.) you've given some basic thought to what your pet will eat.

If they actually said you had to feed the most expensive foods, that's out of line - but it also sounds like you may just be interpreting this as more extreme than it's intended to be.

In general, it sounds like they're just taking seriously their responsibility to find good homes for the animals in their care. I wouldn't see any of that as particularly intrusive, personally. 

Things like being in a pet-unfriendly rental and the landlord finding out, or the pet developing behaviour problems from being lonely and bored, are _major_ reasons animals are surrendered to the shelter in the first place. 

As for having a "stranger" in the home, most people think nothing of calling a repair person or hosting acquaintances at a dinner party, so I guess it's hard for me to see how it would be much of a burden to have someone from the rescue drop by for a few minutes to make sure you aren't a hoarder or something. These aren't white glove inspections.

They do all this _not_ to judge you, but to do their best to ensure this pet will be with you for life and doesn't end up homeless again. Yeah, they could probably adopt out more pets if they didn't make the prospective owner put in an effort to adopt... but if those cats are ending up in the same situation a few years later when the owner turns out to be unprepared or indifferent, they haven't actually gained anything by increasing the sheer numbers going out the door.

Best of luck with your adoption! I hope you have a new family member soon!


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

It's to weed out who is serious and who isn't. Not every place requires all of these things, but most around here do.



purr machine said:


> In order to get a cat from an adoption center, I need to fill out application. I am asked how often I travel, what brand of food and kitty litter I will be using (SERIOUSLY? I absolutely have to use the most expensive food to my cats?), how many hours I am away at work (and if I will be getting the most expensive food, I need to work a lot), where I live, when and where I plan to move.. I will then have an interview, a home visit, and someone will speak to my landlord....


Every shelter makes you fill out an application, it's the total bare minimum. They aren't handing over kittens for over one hundred dollars just because you want to give them money. 

For the questions about how many hours at work and travel they want to know how long the cats will be home alone and if you have backup plans in place for the times you are gone extended periods.

They want to know you have a plan of what food to feed and cat litter because it does not have to be the best (the shelter sure doesn't feed the best!), or anywhere close to that but they want to make sure you've thought of all expenses and if needed they will recommended brands to first time owners. 

Every shelter wants to know where you live - for instance if you live far away, that's a not going to work out - if there's a problem and someone wants to return the cat many in this situation would just throw it on the street. 

They want to make sure if you're moving that it's a thought out process because some places don't allow pets. That also goes into the fact that they need to speak with the landlord to make sure they are on board with pets. 

A lot of people just kick out their cats when they are too much work or there's a conflict of interest (moving, landlord finds out, food costs, cat is clawing stuff) ... they are asking these questions and making you do these things because far too many cats are on the streets or abused. 

They want a home visit to ensure you don't hoard cats or have any other type of seedy things or intentions going on. Sometimes it's just a quick peak in and out.

They are dealing with all sorts of people daily, they don't know you. They need to cover their bases.

It comes down to this, in many ways:
_The numbers of feral cats are not known, but estimates of the US feral population range from 25 to 60 million._



purr machine said:


> And, to be fair, this is more difficult than having a baby human.


Have you ever tried to adopt a baby? I'm sure it's way more complicated. Same deal here, you're adopting. They don't want the cat going to an irresponsible owner. Cats aren't people, but they do deserve a home that fully understands what it takes to raise a cat and can give them a nurturing environment.



purr machine said:


> It is much easier to get a cat from craigslist


Therein lies supporting irresponsible people that don't neuter and spay their pets. You'd be supporting backyard breeders and lazy people that don't deserve to have pets. 

The SPCA and other smaller organizations work had to counteract these people.

Where I live, spaying and neutering is mandatory, yet there's still the largest cat sanctuary in North America in this city. It takes a lot of effort to fight stupid, uncaring, ignorant people. They're trying their best, you should be proud we live in a place that is able to be strict in its adoption process. A lot of places need to give cats away for free, of course that's just making problem perpetrate, but they don't have the funding to do anything else.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

By the way, for the record, on the day I adopt Zephyr I was waiting for a shelter worker to finish checking him for fleas, and I happened to overhear a different shelter worker interviewing another adoptive family.

When they were asked what food they would feed, they replied "Friskies," and the worker accepted that and moved on to the next question. So it's definitely not always to make sure you're buying something spendy.


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## Marcia (Dec 26, 2010)

I have found this to be true for private shelters, but at our city shelter it took only a few minutes with some basic questions about general care, for instance "Are you aware that animals require regular visits to a vet?" Simple "are you a total idiot or not" type of questions. Go to the city shelters - no shortage of needy animals there.


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## 3gatos (Nov 28, 2012)

I've adopted 2 cats from the local humane society. With my first cat they talked about declawing as I stated I wanted a clawed adult. They did ask about food, what we (me and my sister) currently had for the kitty, scratching posts and they had to make sure we owned our home and were allowed to have a cat. My dad came, and we picked out and took Samir home the same day. He was $40

With my second kitty, I was renting, so they had to call my landlord. When they found out I had already adopted from them, they explained much less and I pretty much got the "so you know the process and have all the stuff" and that was it, I picked out the cat, they called my landlord and a week later (I lived 2 hours away so couldn't just pop in any time, and she also needed to be spayed) I had her in the carrier. She was $20


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## MowMow (Nov 6, 2010)

Everything that Carmel said. 

Sounds like you found a good shelter. One that cares about where its cats go and who will take care of them. Now you know where to adopt and who to donate to when you can.


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## Marcia (Dec 26, 2010)

3gatos said:


> I've adopted 2 cats from the local humane society. With my first cat they talked about declawing as I stated I wanted a clawed adult. They did ask about food, what we (me and my sister) currently had for the kitty, scratching posts and they had to make sure we owned our home and were allowed to have a cat. My dad came, and we picked out and took Samir home the same day. He was $40
> 
> *With my second kitty, I was renting, so they had to call my landlord. When they found out I had already adopted from them, they explained much less and I pretty much got the "so you know the process and have all the stuff" and that was it,* I picked out the cat, they called my landlord and a week later (I lived 2 hours away so couldn't just pop in any time, and she also needed to be spayed) I had her in the carrier. She was $20


Maybe that is the difference. I've adopted from my city shelter many times and they probably run my name and it pops up "Crazy Cat Lady, but she's ok".


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## 3gatos (Nov 28, 2012)

Marcia said:


> Maybe that is the difference. I've adopted from my city shelter many times and they probably run my name and it pops up "Crazy Cat Lady, but she's ok".


LOL, I think most of the questions are to make sure you've THOUGHT about the different aspects of owning a cat/dog/pet/etc, not necessarily to tell you what to do or that what you're thinking about doing is wrong. At least that's how it is with my local humane society. I know some of the questions they asked me I hadn't thought about and some I was appalled that people did that.

For example, declawing, I completely forgot that people sometimes did that as it never even crossed my mind. When we talked to the adoption counselor, we told her we really wanted to really help a cat. she said that the older, clawed cats are usually more difficult to adopt. We said, that's what we want then


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## doodlebug (May 13, 2006)

Lots of good info in the posts above. This rescue is trying to do the best they can and avoid people like this:
http://www.catforum.com/forum/36-cat-chat/167538-how-tell-people-not-get-cat.html

Regarding cost...that Craigslist kitten likely comes with no vet check, no vaccines, not spayed or neutered, not dewormed, no flea control and maybe sick. A free kitten is not free.


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## Marcia (Dec 26, 2010)

doodlebug said:


> Lots of good info in the posts above. This rescue is trying to do the best they can and avoid people like this:
> http://www.catforum.com/forum/36-cat-chat/167538-how-tell-people-not-get-cat.html
> 
> Regarding cost...that Craigslist kitten likely comes with no vet check, no vaccines, not spayed or neutered, not dewormed, no flea control and maybe sick. *A free kitten is not free*.


AMEN! My free Missy ended up costing us more that $2500 in eye surgeries a few years after we adopted her. Even a healthy shelter kitty can be expensive but that is the price of pet ownership. General advice: If you think you can't afford vet visits please do not adopt!


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## 3furbabies (Dec 7, 2011)

Hmmm. I have never heard of such a lengthy process, and I thought the shelter I worked at before had a lengthy process(long application and two interviews... no home check though). But the shelter I was at had a high return rate. They want to make sure you are serious and comitted which is why the process is so intrusive. They don't want to see the animal back. I doubt they were suggesting you buy the most costly food... most shelters feed science diet or worse. They just want to see that you are not going to feed them dog food or something and that you set aside a budget for cat costs.

I can assure you that adopting a human baby is waaay more intrusive. My sister was trying to adopt a baby from China a few years back. She had my neice, wanted another one, got pregnant, had a second girl but that one was sick and died shortly after birth. Had trouble getting pregnant again so wanted to adopt. They had to drive all over the province for interviews and adoption related stuff every weekend just to be put on a waiting list. 3 years later, still waited and ended up getting pregnant and having my nephew so told them forget it.


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## NebraskaCat (Jan 15, 2013)

The shelter where I volunteer has an extensive process, but not as much as the OP describes.

Usually the main questions that cause adopters to balk are "are you considering declawing this cat" and "will this cat be indoors only".

The reason we have a thorough adoption process is because our end goal is not to set record numbers of adoptions but to keep the cats' welfare as the number one priority.

We consider our adoption contract a binding legal document, but even then we can't stop people from declawing an older cat then putting him out in the barn and feeding him Meow Mix. That's why we try to invest our time with adopter PRIOR to adoption so that we think we're getting a good quality home for our cats.


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## Arianwen (Jun 3, 2012)

The shelter I support vets you and does a home check (they don't bother with me now because they know the set-up but they have called in when they are collecting cats from the area just fro a cup of coffee and a catch up). It isn't onerous and helps to ensure that they have a *very* low return rate.


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## mstx (Mar 4, 2008)

I got my new kitten from a shelter that ends up fostering all their cats. The lady said that usually there is an application and contract but since I was willing to take him to all his appointments for shots and neutering that I didnt have to fill it out. The only thing that I dont like about the whole application process is when they say they have the right for suprise visits. Its like NO you dont. If you want my cats vet recorders to make sure that they are taken care of fine I will mail them to you or you can talk to my vet. But you are not coming to my house any time you please. Last thing I need is them saying that the cats having their own room (yes the cats have a bedroom where they have tons of toys, cat trees, and eat) is not enough. Maybe thats just me. I hate ppl being at my house anyways lol, I think in the last three years there has been maybe 4 couples that have been allowed in my house lmbo


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

mstx said:


> Last thing I need is them saying that the cats having their own room (yes the cats have a bedroom where they have tons of toys, cat trees, and eat) is not enough. Maybe thats just me.


I guess what I'm not understanding is why people are _assuming_ that the shelter or rescue has extreme standards, or looking at it like they're doing this for the express purpose of judging you as unworthy.

I mean, _you_ aren't worried about the standard of care you provide, right? So why assume that the person who does the home visit will be worried? It just seems like an unnecessary thing to fret unless you're concerned about it on some level yourself.

If not... well, these are regular people too, not superwomen and supermen, and most will have pretty ordinary standards. They don't expect everyone to be super-pet-owner. They just want to make sure the pet is going to a safe home that will keep him or her for life.

Unless you're actually _denied_ the chance to adopt for not doing everything in some impossibly perfect way, assuming that those are the odds you are up against just seems to me like borrowing trouble. *shrug*


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## BigDaveyL (Jun 26, 2012)

doodlebug said:


> Regarding cost...that Craigslist kitten likely comes with no vet check, no vaccines, not spayed or neutered, not dewormed, no flea control and maybe sick. A free kitten is not free.


Totally agree here. I got both my cats on free days from a shelter but gave a donation anyways. I felt guilty since they vetted both cats and at least ensured they are up to date and healthy and spayed/neutered. That is worth something in my book.


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## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

I received just the response to the topic that I thought I would.. But that is ok. I have a lot of things to say, so bare with me  Or don't 



Blakeney Green said:


> Did they actually say you have to use the most expensive cat food, or are you just assuming?


Of course I am assuming.  And I am absolutely aware of that. And I know they want the best for the pets in their care, but this is not the point I wanted to make... Many people will assume, just like I did, and many people will stop filling it out in the middle of the process, and decide not to adopt from that place, because they will assume that they will be judged by the litter they are using.



Carmel said:


> it's to weed out who is serious and who isn't.


And where will the people go, who were denied a cat from a shelter? They will get a cat elsewhere. None of them will stop wanting a cat after being denied one.
I would rather they took a cat from shelter. And were told there, that it is ok to call if they have questions or concerns. And it is ok to bring cat back, no questions asked. Less cats would be on the streets.



> Therein lies supporting irresponsible people that don't neuter and spay their pets. You'd be supporting backyard breeders and lazy people that don't deserve to have pets.


Many people are not aware that this problem even exists. 99% of people I know strongly believe that there is no such thing as feral or homeless cats. Because where I live, there are no cats just hanging out on the streets. Those people are not "bad" or "uneducated". They are educated in many fields, just not this particular issue. Therefore, they may just get a cat from a random person truly believing there is nothing wrong with it. Especially if getting a 9 month old black kitten from shelter costs $175 plus application and providing references, plus home visits, and getting same cat that someone just doesn't want anymore from craigslist is free.

Before I joined this forum, I had no idea that cat overpopulation was a problem. I have never seen a homeless cat around here. I had 2 cats coming over for food, but I thought it was some neighbors' cats. And they might actually be someone else's free roaming cats that come and go as they please. 




Arianwen said:


> The shelter I support vets you and does a home check (they don't bother with me now because they know the set-up but they have called in when they are collecting cats from the area just fro a cup of coffee and a catch up). It isn't onerous and helps to ensure that they have a very low return rate.


Shelters with low return rate bother me the most  haha 

The reason is, due to their great weeding our process, they have selected the best, most responsible and solid people out there for their cats. The people who did their research prior to adopting, who know the ropes, who are diligent, and will take care of their cats. These people would never return or dump any cat, no matter if they would get the kitten from their neighbor who had accidental kittens, or from that particular shelter. 

So the problem with dumped cats and overbreeding cats remains unsolved. No one who really wants a cat will just stop looking for one because they didn't want to go through adoption process, or were denied a cat. They will get a cat elsewhere. And then they will have no idea what to do with this kitten when it gets sick, or start misbehaving. And then they will not know where to go with their problems. And they will become despaired, and want to get rid of the cat. They will put up a craigslist add, but no one will want an older cat with a horrible picture taken with their horrible phone and description of a fat misbehaving cat who is looking for a new home as it won't stop scratching children and ruining furniture. And this cat will be dumped  
On the other hand, if the shelter did let them get a cat, and provided some support, and did let them return the cat, sacrificing their low return rates, the cat would not end up in the streets. 



mstx said:


> The only thing that I dont like about the whole application process is when they say they have the right for suprise visits. Its like NO you dont. If you want my cats vet recorders to make sure that they are taken care of fine I will mail them to you or you can talk to my vet. But you are not coming to my house any time you please. Last thing I need is them saying that the cats having their own room (yes the cats have a bedroom where they have tons of toys, cat trees, and eat) is not enough. Maybe thats just me. I hate ppl being at my house anyways lol, I think in the last three years there has been maybe 4 couples that have been allowed in my house lmbo


Same with me. Especially with me working crazy day-night shifts, sometimes sleeping during days, and my house looking like a bomb went off after I had four 12 hour shifts in a row. A last thing I want is someone knocking on my door with their surprise visit. I know many people invite tons of people over weekly, our family is living a private life, we only have close friends and family over, and only by invitation. We socialize in large groups only in neutral spaces, like restaurants, etc. This is a big issue for me.



Blakeney Green said:


> I guess what I'm not understanding is why people are assuming that the shelter or rescue has extreme standards, or looking at it like they're doing this for the express purpose of judging you as unworthy.


For me personally it is not assuming, or fearing that I will not meet the standards. I just do not like to be evaluated, period. No matter if I meet someone else's standards or not. And secondly, I do not like strangers in my house. Ever. No matter what they plan to do there. I hate when firemen come over to my apartment to check out if my fire alarm is working  I just don't want them to be there, and I only tolerate it because i cannot avoid it. 
Me, as well as many people out there, will pick not to have strangers in my own house, no matter what the reason for their visit is.


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

purr machine said:


> Many people will assume, just like I did, and many people will stop filling it out in the middle of the process, and decide not to adopt from that place, because they will assume that they will be judged by the litter they are using.


Then that's their fault, making assumptions is never the way to go about anything. Even in vet offices when you are a new client you fill out a forum, with questions that include asking what food you feed.



purr machine said:


> And were told there, that it is ok to call if they have questions or concerns. And it is ok to bring cat back, no questions asked. Less cats would be on the streets.


This is the case at shelters, they will take a cat back. 

No questions asked however is never going to fly; they need to know if it was the owners own idiocy (they're having a baby, got a dog, don't like it scratching on furniture...) or if the cat may have health or behaviour problems that need to be addressed and/or warn the next potential adopters.



purr machine said:


> Many people are not aware that this problem even exists. 99% of people I know strongly believe that there is no such thing as feral or homeless cats. Because where I live, there are no cats just hanging out on the streets.
> 
> ...
> 
> I have never seen a homeless cat around here. I had 2 cats coming over for food, but I thought it was some neighbors' cats. And they might actually be someone else's free roaming cats that come and go as they please.


BC doesn't have a large number of ferals in its cities compared to many places... this is due to BC leading the way in many of those "serious" adoption processes and along with that, we're quite wealthy. Northern BC is a whole different ball game, though. They have packs of wild dogs on reservations.

I also mentioned previously that Richmond has the largest cat sanctuary in North America. That started with a lot of money, volunteers, education, TNR (trap, neuter, return), and a shift in thinking. At their peak the sanctuary had over 900 cats. Richmond has mandatory spay neuter bylaws, low cost spay and neuter, and a no-kill shelter. They have all the same icky adoption processes you speak of, but the number of cats at the sanctuary has gone down to 700. 

It is education and a lot of proactive effort that makes the difference. Handing out cats to people without screening them is counterproductive. Period. 

Also, depite not seeing a feral, they are there. Ferals hide and run from humans, they aren't often out in the day if people are around. All of my cats were feral cats, from my own backyard or city.

Just because you aren't active in the TNR and feral colonies doesn't mean they don't exist. They do, they're everywhere. 

The cats you feed could very likely be abandoned stray cats without a home. People like to leave cats at their door when they move.



purr machine said:


> due to their great weeding our process, they have selected the best, most responsible and solid people out there for their cats. The people who did their research prior to adopting, who know the ropes, who are diligent, and will take care of their cats. These people would never return or dump any cat, no matter if they would get the kitten from their neighbor who had accidental kittens, or from that particular shelter.


It isn't a great weeding process. They don't have high standards, we've already established that. They just want to make sure you aren't going to feed your cat dog food, throw newspapers on the floor for them to pee on, be gone 20 hours a day on weekdays and not at all on weekends, and that you aren't hoarding pets.

If you can't be bothered to fill out a forum, and allow a quick house visit, then they'd rather you not adopt - you don't seem the type that's serious, and likely have something to hide. If you then choose other methods of acquiring a pet, so be it.

Backyard breeders and irresponsible owners will always exist, shelters are not going to be able to stop them from going other routes, but they can at least hinder the process, and educate the public, and do TNR. It works.


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## Nell (Apr 7, 2005)

I think that some shelter's adoption processes are a bit over the top. I know that they want to make sure their animals end up in good homes and that people have put enough thought into owning a pet, but all it takes is for potential adopters (and potentially very good adopters) to _feel_ like their being judged harshly, regardless of whether or not they actually are, to walk away. Maybe if the questions were worded differently or asked in a different context, it may not feel so judgmental. 
Personally I would never adopt from a rescue that thought they had the right to surprise or random home visits. It is far too intrusive for me. One home visit before the adoption would be reasonable, though. I would expect to be asked for my address and if I owned or rented and contact info for my landlord, number and types of other pets, a vet reference and that sort of thing. I would expect that someone from the rescue would spend a little bit of time talking to me to get a feel if I should own a pet and how I take care of mine. 
I've adopted from a rescue twice, once for a rabbit and once for a cat, and the process was pretty simple... spend some time with a volunteer looking at the animals, take some time in a private room to visit with a few, fill out a pretty basic application, wait for them to check references and then go and pick up my new pet. With my rabbit, I had filled out an application ahead of time so I was able to take him home the same day.


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

Nell said:


> I think that some shelter's adoption processes are a bit over the top. I know that they want to make sure their animals end up in good homes and that people have put enough thought into owning a pet, but all it takes is for potential adopters (and potentially very good adopters) to _feel_ like their being judged harshly, regardless of whether or not they actually are, to walk away.


If those people assume, that's their fault. A lot of those questions are there to make people aware of all aspects of cat ownership, and so people will ask questions to the shelter workers on anything they are unsure of. "Why can't we declaw?" ... etc. and the explanations given hopefully make a difference. In reality, the shelter can never follow up on these things, but they can educate as best they can.

If they are good people that just can't be bothered to see what all the fuss is about with the home check and application, and then go out and get a cat elsewhere, spay/neuter, and be a great owner... so be it.

A lot of people that are denied at a shelter can't be bothered to hunt for a cat elsewhere, they aren't that serious about it all, and as already mentioned... a free cat is never free.



Nell said:


> Personally I would never adopt from a rescue that thought they had the right to surprise or random home visits. It is far too intrusive for me. One home visit before the adoption would be reasonable, though.


I agree this concept seems intrusive, but the reality is it pretty much never happens. There may be a follow up phone call, but there are a _lot_ of animals coming in and out of a shelter, they aren't dropping by for a visit. They don't have the manpower or time. 

If they do, it is probably a special case where a cat may have had serious issues in a new home, and they want to make sure it's a good fit. Or, someone they flagged as potentially not being a good owner.

This "house check at any time" is used to scare away anyone that doesn't want people to know what their house looks like when the visit is not prearranged. Most people can make a house look decent if it's scheduled, they can hide whatever they want, including the other pets and children they have when the cat they're trying to adopt is listed as an single cat home with no dogs/cats/children.


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

Oh, and meant to add, the house check at any time is also meant to help prevent people from allowing their cat outdoors or declawing them when the shelter application likely asks for your agreement of these things to not happen. It could be the difference between "let's just let it outside/declaw" and "better not...".


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

purr machine said:


> For me personally it is not assuming, or fearing that I will not meet the standards. I just do not like to be evaluated, period. No matter if I meet someone else's standards or not.


You know, I do get this - I don't like it much either. I don't think anyone particularly does.

But the thing is, in the real world, it's unavoidable. "I don't like to be evaluated" isn't going to fly in the workplace, or when you're applying for a loan, or when your spouse is telling you that you that you've hurt their feelings. It's simply not possible to get through life without ever exposing yourself to scrutiny.

That being the case... it's just a matter of whether adopting a cat is important enough to you (general you, not any specific person) or not. If it is, you may have to just once tolerate doing something you don't like.

If someone decides it's not worth it and gives up on the adoption, okay. If someone isn't willing to go beyond their own assumptions and actually ask for a clarification, it is what it is. Sure, it's unfortunate - but I don't see how it's the shelter's fault. 

The only alternative is having no standards at all, and that's not good for cats. It's not safe, and it doesn't protect them from being homeless again. If there's any standard at all, _someone_ is not going to like it. A shelter can't and shouldn't sacrifice the safety and well-being of cats to make sure no human could ever possibly feel inconvenienced. So that means the bottom line is, some people will be cool with it and some won't - you can't please everyone.

Most shelters will gladly help adopters who are having problems. That's really a different issue than adoption standards.


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## marie73 (Jul 12, 2006)

The agency I adopted Gigi from wouldn't take her back. Jerks. Even though it was in the contract that I *couldn't* do anything *besides* give her back to them if it didn't work out. They said they'd re-advertise her, but I had to let random strangers come into my house to meet her.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

marie73 said:


> The agency I adopted Gigi from wouldn't take her back. Jerks. Even though it was in the contract that I *couldn't* do anything *besides* give her back to them if it didn't work out.


That is incredibly uncool. 

I think that by taking the responsibility of placing a cat in a home, the agency/shelter/rescue is also taking the responsibility of taking them back if it doesn't work out. Ideally all homes would be forever, but unfortunately that just isn't always possible. 

If an agency gets involved, it needs to be as a resource for life, not just out the door and not their problem.


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## Nell (Apr 7, 2005)

Carmel said:


> If those people assume, that's their fault.


Some people are overly sensitive, but if something is worded or asked in a way that enough people misinterpret it or feel it's judgmental, then it's the fault of the person writing it, not the one's reading it. Just because you seem to understand their intentions doesn't mean that someone adopting a pet from that shelter, or any shelter, for the first time will too.


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

If a potential owner can't ask questions and see the merits of an application forum and understand its purpose... really, what is the shelter supposed to do? Have a large disclaimer saying **we do not discriminate**? Of course they do, it's an adoption application that will be thoroughly reviewed to ensure the cat is going to a home that understands what ownership of a cat entails. 

How do you propose they ask you what you will feed your cat, etc.? Some people honestly haven't thought about this, don't know the cost of food, or don't even realise they should be feeding cat food.

As Blakeney Green said, it's a part of life to be evaluated and judged. Anything, by anybody, can be taken the wrong way. Someone is_ always _going to be offended. The good news is, they're looking out for the cats, not the people. They need to make sure you've thought about these things. You're adopting another living being, and the effort taken in getting a pet can often reflect how serious you are about the commitment.


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## Tiliqua (Jan 22, 2013)

I had to fill out a very extensive form in order to be able to foster cats for a local no-kill shelter. Basically, to volunteer for them. They needed to visit the house, I filled out several pages of questions on how I would discipline and how I would deal with behavior problems and I needed 3 references including my vet.

I CHOSE to foster for that shelter because I agreed with their ideals most. I liked that it was an extensive process because it means they really care about the cats and care about them getting a good home. Plus, it gives me peace of mind that before a foster cat comes into my home it will be healthy and won't have anything that might be passed onto my cats.

It's odd that you mentioned diet - in a discussion with the shelter I foster for, I was asked not to feed raw or canned diets because people who adopt will likely just feed kibble. So getting a cat used to canned or raw food means that it may have trouble transitioning to kibble and any issues with eating might mean costly vet bills for the shelter. I doubt they were judging you based on the diet you planned to provide (or the cost), but just wanted to make sure that you'd thought about it.


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## ecat (Nov 18, 2012)

It is a fine line between competing with backyard breeders (like it or not, they are competing suppliers of cats) and adopting out cats to irresponsible people.

I tend to agree that some shelter application processes are onerous. We certainly were not asked for details of food and kitty litter brands when we adopted Mavis. 

Personally I do feel that it would be better to adopt out more cats with a slightly less intrusive adoption process,. This way shelters may have some impact on the demand side (for BYB and petshop cats). I don't think that a slight relaxation of standards would significantly increase returns. In fact, couldn't these "intrusive" questions be asked in a short interview rather than on a form?

It would be nice if people weren't put off by requests for house inspections, etc. However, I don't think it is fair to say that these people are not serious about cat ownership/would be bad cat owners just because they have a heightened sense of privacy.


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## doodlebug (May 13, 2006)

purr machine said:


> For me personally it is not assuming, or fearing that I will not meet the standards. I just do not like to be evaluated, period. No matter if I meet someone else's standards or not.


On another thread, you talked about people with biases that color the information they provide. Given the statement above from you, do you think that maybe your biases are coloring your opinion of the adoption process? As a former adoption counselor, I can tell you that your attitude was the rare exception. Those who were educated pet owners had no problem with the process, even welcomed it. Those that weren't educated didn't know enough to realize that the application could identify problems. In my experience, bad pet owners never realize that they're bad, until someone educates them. Some will embrace that education, others won't. 

The application is used as a tool to gain information about the potential adopter and as a jumping off place to start conversation and possibly education. If there is no application/screening process, then there is no education for those that need it and they will continue being bad pet owners. The cat will come back or be tossed in the street and the vicious circle continues. 

As for surprise visits...I think a shelter that includes that kind of requirement is a bit over the top. They have no legal leg to stand on. You can deny access to your house even if you signed the paperwork. That's one criteria that I think does more harm than good. Thankfully, I think that not many shelters have this type of requirement.


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## MowMow (Nov 6, 2010)

^^ All of this. Well said.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

ecat said:


> However, I don't think it is fair to say that these people are not serious about cat ownership/would be bad cat owners just because they have a heightened sense of privacy.


I don't think anyone is saying they would be bad owners. What we're saying is that 1.) since they aren't willing/able to take the steps to demonstrate they are _good_ owners, the agency can't possibly know one way or the other, and 2.) they simply are not a match for the standards of this particular agency because they aren't willing/able to complete the agency's process. 

"Not a match" and "bad owner" are two entirely different things.

Regarding the surprise visits thing, I think that is generally more covering their behind if they sometime later have reason to believe that the animal is being abused or neglected and they need to take future action, rather than something they do as standard policy. 

I signed a document six and a half years ago that I would allow surprise visits for the shelter to check on Zephyr. I haven't gotten so much as a phone call from them. They have no reason to believe he's anything other than fine, so no visit has been necessary.

If they did want to come by (unlikely since I live in a different country now,) I wouldn't mind. I'm private about my emotions, but not about my home. As long as they don't want me to talk about my feelings, we're good.


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## jadis (Jul 9, 2011)

I foster cats and the rescue I work with did a home visit before I was allowed to foster for them. I was actually nervous about it and I know alot of adopters are too, but it was completely painless. A lady from the rescue brought the foster cat over and did the home check at the same time, which basically consisted of sitting in my living room for a few minutes while the cat checked things out, then I showed the cat and her where the litter boxes were, showed her my other cats, she said my house was cute, and that was it. 

When I do home visits I do it the same way. I like to bring the cat with me and the new adopters generally can't wait to play with the cat show me stuff they've bought. I'm not looking for anything in particular, just that you are who you say you are, live where you say you live, and have prepared for the cat I am bringing over.

No one has ever failed on the home visit, it's a formality. Problems are usually found during the application process, and for us basically we want to know that you won't declaw, the cat will be an indoor cat, you have a vet that you use or plan to use, you are allowed to have a cat where you live, and that you'll return it to us if you can't keep it for any reason. We don't ask any questions about food or litter.


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## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

Thank you for your replies. Many points from different people seem similar, so I won't quote all of them.. But you know who you are 



Carmel said:


> They just want to make sure you aren't going to feed your cat dog food, throw newspapers on the floor for them to pee on, be gone 20 hours a day on weekdays and not at all on weekends, and that you aren't hoarding pets.


This is an interesting point. 
I do not think a pet hoarder would write that down in application. I also don't think that people who plan on torturing their pets will write this down in applications. Same thing with the rest of people, who plan to mistreat their animals, would probably not mention it during interview or in application.. 



> If you can't be bothered to fill out a forum, and allow a quick house visit, then they'd rather you not adopt - you don't seem the type that's serious, and likely have something to hide. If you then choose other methods of acquiring a pet, so be it.


Good point. 

It may seem like there are not so many people in the world that would have something against the process, if most of your friends and people you usually talk to agree with your point. 


Perfectly good people, perfectly good homes. I would rather give a cat or a dog to each of them, than send that same dog to its death because shelters are overpopulated, and there is nothing else left to do with that pet. 



> But the thing is, in the real world, it's unavoidable. "I don't like to be evaluated" isn't going to fly in the workplace, or when you're applying for a loan, or when your spouse is telling you that you that you've hurt their feelings. It's simply not possible to get through life without ever exposing yourself to scrutiny.


These are 2 very different things, and lets not mix them all together.

For every 1 job position an employer would get from 10-100 and more applications and resumes. So of course employer will evaluate applicants, and will find the best one. 
Same is with education. When I applied to college, there where over 900 applicants, and only 60 spaces to fill. So we were screened, interviewed, etc to find the best 60 out of the 900.

The cat situation is unfortunately reversed. 

Here is the actual statistics from the US from ASPCA:

_Approximately 5 million to 7 million companion animals enter animal shelters nationwide every year, and approximately 3 million to 4 million are euthanized (60 percent of dogs and 70 percent of cats)._

Lets face it, there are 3-4 millions of pets in US every year that not a single person wants to adopt. And if one person comes in and wants to adopt one of the 3 million cats, you cannot say that this person needs to be evaluated as much as any person applying for a job would. 

No kill shelters are a good idea, only the animals they cannot accept when they are full will go to a kill shelter, and they will be killed. If one shelter accepted 50 animals, and rehomed them into perfect homes with low turnaround rate it doesn't say much about real life life of abandoned cats in general, as for each 50 cats adopted, 150 will be euthanized. 
And if turnaround was somewhat friendlier to adopters, maybe more cats would be adopted.

Quote from The Winnipeg Humane Society:

_"All animal rescue shelters are full all of the time, but there is still a continuous stream of cats and kittens that need help. There are simply too many cats and not enough homes for all of them."_


I don't know about you guys, but my logic says, *do not scare potential cat adopters.* Don't try to measure everyone by your own standards, like "if you don't want someone giving you a visit, maybe you have something to hide, and maybe you are better off not adopting". This is an insane reason to deny a perfectly good home to a cat, while so many are getting killed each year.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

purr machine said:


> And if one person comes in and wants to adopt one of the 3 million cats, you cannot say that this person needs to be evaluated as much as any person applying for a job would.


"As much" is a relative thing, and in a way that's true - when someone applies to adopt a cat, then for example it's irrelevant what their educational background is, while that would matter for a job.

However, if you're saying it's less _important_ to evaluate the prospective adopters by relevant standards, I completely disagree. A cat is a living creature whose health, safety, and continued existence are completely in the hands of the adopter they're being entrusted to.

Without evaluation, all the agency has is the person's word that they won't harm or abandon the cat. I can't blame them for feeling that isn't good enough, especially if they're supposed to avoid asking any specifics about the care the pet will receive in case the prospective owner finds it offensive.

I don't think the cat overpopulation problem (and it _is_ a huge problem) means dropping all standards. There are _much_ worse things that can happen to a cat than being humanely put to sleep in a shelter, and evaluations are intended to weed out as many of those worse things as possible. 

If there are any standards at all, someone somewhere isn't going to like it - so rather than trying to please everybody by doing no evaluation at all, I think it's better for the shelter or rescue to find a balance they feel comfortable with.


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## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

Blakeney Green, 
While some standards should exist, the question is how high those standards should be. And what are the dangers or bright sides of being friendly and inviting to potential adopters, kindly educating and guiding them through the process instead of evaluating them.



> There are much worse things that can happen to a cat than being humanely put to sleep in a shelter, and evaluations are intended to weed out as many of those worse things as possible.


From 2000 to 2013 there were 2890 cases of abuse towards cats. And there are 73 million owned cats in the US. That is 0.004% of cats are abused over 13 years. Or 0.0003% per year if we are counting all the cats that are owned in US. Chances that an animal abuser will come in to any particular shelter are extremely small and close to zero.

Also statistics shows that most people who give up their adopted or purchased pets due to pet misbehavior. None of the screening will help determine how a person will deal with difficult situations in cat's behavior, as the adopters themselves might have no idea how they will deal with those situations unless they arise. Even a skilled cat owner may be caught off guard by a very difficult cat. And most people overestimate their own skills of dealing with problems. At the same time while adopters are being screened for being hoarders, which is veeery unlikely they will find one (and if they will, it will be on the news), animals will be abandoned by well-meaning people who jumped through all the hoops of the adoption process and just has no idea what to do with a screaming cat.

Again, according to statistics, only 20% of people who want a new pet will consider adopting from a shelter. 80% will get their pet elsewhere, and will do whatever they feel like with that pet and will probably not receive any information on when to go to a vet, what to do if problems come up. Strict shelter screening will cause a decrease in those 20%. More "independent" backyard breeders will be able to always sell all their kittens and get money for it. Yes, shelters will give away their few cats to a few very nice people. And if this is their goal, than they are doing a great job.


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## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

Carmel said:


> No questions asked however is never going to fly; they need to know if it was the owners own idiocy (they're having a baby, got a dog, don't like it scratching on furniture...) or if the cat may have health or behaviour problems that need to be addressed and/or warn the next potential adopters.


Too bad. People will feel bad about themselves, and will quietly leave their cat somewhere, feeling guilty, but not wanting to be judged. If they are told that things happen, and sometimes new cat owners feel overwhelmed, and bring your kitty back if you just can't take it anymore.

Working in a hospital, I know that many people who smoke or that are obese will not go to their doctor in a timely manner, because deep down they know they should change their habits, and the doctor will tell them about it. People avoiding judgement of other people and doing silly things as a result is a real problem. And the solution is not to say "too bad you are an idiot.." 

Perhaps a solution would be to acknowledge that they tried, and that most people fail sometimes in some things in life, and if you are feeling overwhelmed with a new cat - it is fine, and very common. And there is help and support. This would fly better, than an angry lady questioning them and trying to figure out if they are returning the cat because of their own idiocy. And having this kind of support and lack of judgement may help keep cats off the street and people will be willing to try again.


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

You're basically saying, don't ask questions, it's all good. It isn't, and it's essential to ask questions. Doodlebug has already mentioned, you're in the vast minority for feeling this way.

You totally overlooked my point that BC has most shelters in the lower mainland follow these rules and they're all doing just fine. You said as much yourself, in mentioning that you don't even see cats outdoors... that doesn't come about when you have an out of control population of cats. 

We have TNR, we have low cost spay and neuter, we have no-kill shelters, we have a huge cat sanctuary where the number of of cats is lessening, kittens especially are often flying out the doors. Shelters charge like 150 dollars for them, too! A lot of places can't _give away_ cats. We get dogs shipped to us because people want little dogs are there _aren't any_ in shelters. And we _also_ have those intrusive policies you don't like.

When you return anything -- anywhere -- they're going to ask why, and often not accept it back if you've owned it too long. I don't even know why you're talking about an "angry lady" ... I mean, is this some kind of personal experience for you or something? Who says they're angry? Trying to figure out why? You bet. Dealing with idiots daily? Yep. Under staffed and underfunded? Yep. But every shelter worker is going to react differently and hopefully act professionally no matter the reason for the return of an animal. They don't have to by angry about it, and assuming they will be angry is ridiculous. There's a difference between needing to know a cause for return and being snooty about it.


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## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

Carmel said:


> You're basically saying, don't ask questions, it's all good. It isn't, and it's essential to ask questions.


I never said anything like that. 
From what you are saying, it is either white or black, shelters will either do 2 visits and ask to fill out 7-page application, or will ask no questions at all and will give out free kitties and puppies in the streets. 



> Doodlebug has already mentioned, you're in the vast minority for feeling this way.


Have you made a research on this, or can a few people agree on a matter and call it a fact?
Some people do mention in this topic that maybe the process is a bit too much, some people would not care to read or comment, doesn't mean that everyone agrees. 
What statistics shows only 20% of people who need new pets will go to shelter. So clearly 80% of people have a reason not to go there. 



> You totally overlooked my point that BC has most shelters in the lower mainland follow these rules and they're all doing just fine. You said as much yourself, in mentioning that you don't even see cats outdoors... that doesn't come about when you have an out of control population of cats.


I've lived in BC for the last 5 years only, so this is not my only point of reference. And TNR and other cat population activities have nothing to so with effectiveness of shelter screening process.



> I don't even know why you're talking about an "angry lady" ... I mean, is this some kind of personal experience for you or something?


My only experience so far was your phrase: _No questions asked however is never going to fly; they need to know if it was the owners own idiocy_. Didn't sound too friendly, and I'm not even returning a cat to you. Just saying, this does not sound like a beginning of a very friendly and non-judgmental conversation.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

purr machine said:


> Blakeney Green,
> While some standards should exist, the question is how high those standards should be. And what are the dangers or bright sides of being friendly and inviting to potential adopters, kindly educating and guiding them through the process instead of evaluating them.


How are those things mutually exclusive? How are the owners going to know they need to be educated if they don't know what the issues in pet ownership are? How are the shelter workers supposed to know who needs guidance if they don't ask where people already are in their knowledge?

Obviously, not everyone is going to agree about what level of evaluation is appropriate.

However, _any_ level of evaluation is going to bother _somebody_. That's why I think it's pointless to try to accommodate every human preference; it simply can't be done.



purr machine said:


> I never said anything like that.
> From what you are saying, it is either white or black, shelters will either do 2 visits and ask to fill out 7-page application, or will ask no questions at all and will give out free kitties and puppies in the streets.


But the thing is, everything can't be judged by _your_ personal standards. 

What bothers you doesn't bother me - why are you right and I'm wrong?

What if something bothers another person, but you're okay with with it?

I don't think anyone is saying that the rules have to be extreme. The issue is that not everyone agrees on what is "extreme" and what is reasonable. Obviously everyone thinks they're being reasonable, or they wouldn't do it.



> From 2000 to 2013 there were 2890 cases of abuse towards cats. And there are 73 million owned cats in the US. That is 0.004% of cats are abused over 13 years. Or 0.0003% per year if we are counting all the cats that are owned in US. Chances that an animal abuser will come in to any particular shelter are extremely small and close to zero.


I didn't just mean abuse. That's one issue among many.

Also, that's a statistic of _reported_ abuse. The vast majority of pet abuse cases are never reported, and only a fraction of them result in a conviction. Like I said, I meant more than just abuse, but just for the sake of clarity. 



> Also statistics shows that most people who give up their adopted or purchased pets due to pet misbehavior. None of the screening will help determine how a person will deal with difficult situations in cat's behavior, as the adopters themselves might have no idea how they will deal with those situations unless they arise. Even a skilled cat owner may be caught off guard by a very difficult cat. And most people overestimate their own skills of dealing with problems. At the same time while adopters are being screened for being hoarders, which is veeery unlikely they will find one (and if they will, it will be on the news), animals will be abandoned by well-meaning people who jumped through all the hoops of the adoption process and just has no idea what to do with a screaming cat.


I disagree. A lot of the "misbehaviours" are in fact fairly predictable issues - litterbox, inappropriate clawing, boredom behaviours, etc. Of course there's the occasional completely unpredictable extreme problem, but from all I've seen that's rather rare. 

That's _exactly_ the sort of question shelters are asking. 

Obviously thinking about it in the abstract is different than dealing with it, but at least it gets people thinking.

Again, yes - I do think the quantity of homes has to be balanced against the quality. Shelters can only take responsibility for their own choices, not the choices of the whole pet-owning world.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

By the way, for the record, the reason I feel so passionate about this is that I've spent the past five years trying to help a pet who was horribly damaged by owners who would never have passed a screening. He could have been spared a lot of pain if someone had just asked those questions about food and basic behavioural issues.

Shelters can't screen the whole world. But if they can spare a few pets what he went through, I'm on board.


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## jadis (Jul 9, 2011)

I have never seen or heard of shelters asking the kinds of questions you are talking about or doing home visits. When I got Cheddar Biscuit I basically paid $50 and left with a cat. There are plenty of shelters that ask no questions, and if you are uncomfortable with lengthy application processes, that's a great way to go. Those cats are probably the ones that need help the most. Even if you get one off craigslist or from a neighbor or whatever, you are probably saving a cat that would end up in a shelter otherwise, so it's all good to me.

There are plusses and minuses any way you go. Rescues put alot into each cat, way more than city run shelters, and more than the person giving away free kittens on CL or in front of walmart. Rescues fully vet and spay/neuter their cats and fosters spend their own money on food, litter, toys, and house these cats sometimes long term. In my case I've had one for 6 months now, and I am glad I work with a group that is picky about where she will go. Rescues place each cat as if they are placing their own personal cat because that is how we feel about them. There are alot of benefits to this approach, but if you are a private person and don't wish to go through the process, there are other ways to go. Just spay/neuter and enjoy your pet!


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## jadis (Jul 9, 2011)

Also wanted to add about behavioral issues, one thing we try to do through the application process is build a relationship with the adopter so that if an issue arises, the adopter will feel comfortable asking questions. We have alot of people with alot of cat experience that can give advise.


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## Carmel (Nov 23, 2010)

purr machine said:


> I never said anything like that.
> From what you are saying, it is either white or black, shelters will either do 2 visits and ask to fill out 7-page application, or will ask no questions at all and will give out free kitties and puppies in the streets.


I wasn't saying it's black and white, but that the problems you seem to face with these applications and (in some cases where shelters aren't overun) home visits... are not extreme to the general population. I agreed that the "drop by any time" shelter policies are intrusive, they have their reasons but I totally understand people seeing that as over the top. Not a lot of shelters do this, as it_ is_ crossing a line to many people.



purr machine said:


> What statistics shows only 20% of people who need new pets will go to shelter. So clearly 80% of people have a reason not to go there.


I'm not sure about those statistics. Any statistics can be altered especially if the article has an agenda. Even if the other 80% did not get pets from a shelter, there are likely other reasons than "too much effort" .. I imagine most would have it come down to wanting a purebred. 



purr machine said:


> And TNR and other cat population activities have nothing to so with effectiveness of shelter screening process.


I think you're wrong there. Before roughly the 90's there were way more free roaming cats. They're being cut down, surely but slowly thanks to TNR and spay and neuter efforts. 

When a place is genuinely overrun with cats without the help of TNR and spay/neuter promotion shelters are overwhelmed. They need to lower standards or euthanize a lot more animals in locations where these things aren't heavily practiced. These are the sort of locations just trying to stay afloat where people can walk in and out with an animal. Luckily, we don't live in a location like this. I think that directly correlates to how choosy shelters can be in their adoption process. The fact that we live in a place where most shelters (unlike many areas where they can be in the vast minority) require applications and a home visit speaks to the fact that our area is doing well in the fight against over population of cats.



purr machine said:


> My only experience so far was your phrase: _No questions asked however is never going to fly; they need to know if it was the owners own idiocy_. Didn't sound too friendly, and I'm not even returning a cat to you. Just saying, this does not sound like a beginning of a very friendly and non-judgmental conversation.


Oh I see, sorry about that. But someone returning a cat because they're moving or didn't expect a cat to claw stuff is more or less linked to idiocy in my mind. There's too many animals returned because of pretty flimsy reasoning. That does not directly relate to how the shelter worker should treat them however, as I said, they should be professional.


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## builder (Sep 2, 2012)

I understand there is a need for that sort of thing, but I don’t think I would ever do that because there are just too many needing a home from the county shelter and from shopping carts in front of grocery stores.


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## gosha (Oct 16, 2011)

We were going to adopt from one of the private shelters, but their process was so long and on almost every cat's ad it said no children under 7 or dogs. We are good family and we take good care of out pets but we had no time for multiply visits to and from the shelter, jumping through hoops and we wouldn't lie about children or dogs. My fiance has 2 dogs and we plan another child in the future. I know little kitten could be trained to like dogs or children, but the shelter made it clear no dogs or children so we went to humane society and brought a kitten home the same day. While i agree there should be some sort of screening, but you can't protect every cat from evil. Just like some human adopted kids sometimes are being tortured and killed, some cats will end up in irresponsible or sociopaths hands, but majority people come to adopt with good intentions and they shouldn't be stopped.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

coyt said:


> Also--I'm sure someone's said it already but, OP says 175 for a shelter cat is expensive. Some shelters charge less, sure, but that doesn't mean 175 is expensive. When you take into account all of the things the cat "comes with"--microchip, spay/neuter, deworming, multiple vaccines, etc-- the total cost of doing all of those things on your own to a cat you got for "free" on Craigslist is WAY WAY higher than 175. Plus you don't have any idea how healthy a free Craigslist cat could be.


I agree, and I also think it's important to remember that the adoption fee doesn't just reflect what was spent on _your_ cat - the organization has to find some way of covering their total costs, too.

They may have not spent much on the healthy young pet you're looking at (general you, not the OP specifically,) but what about the senior pet who had years' worth of untreated illness and will require medical support for the rest of her life, or the cat who was abused nearly to death and required extensive treatment to recover?

The vet bills for _those_ cats could easily have been thousands of dollars, and the shelter can't pull money from thin air. Nor is it reasonable for the shelter to tell some adopters (who are usually taking the tougher-to-place animals already) that their adoption fee will be $4,000 because that's what was actually spent on their specific animal, while someone else walks away with an easier-to-place pet for $50. They have to be fair about it.

What you are paying for your cat is an average of what has been spent on all the animals - and usually falls well short and has to be supplemented by lots of donations - not what was actually spent on your particular pet.


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## Gummers (Mar 8, 2012)

All my cats are from Craigslist. I love them all very much, but how much the previous owners cared about who I was differed wildly. With Robin, (whom I received as a kitten) the people wanted to see my home (which was fine, I think they just wanted to make sure I didn't have a snake or something). With Toby, I had to go to the previous owners house and they grilled me a little with questions (which was fine too). However, with Gummi (who I got as a kitten) they barely parked long enough at Wal-Mart to toss him and his sister at me at 6 weeks old (I thought that they were 9 weeks at the time but the vet said differently). 

Craigslist is great for free/fast cats, but not always the cheapest. (ie: I had to take care of all vet expenses, especially with the little ones.)


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## Arianwen (Jun 3, 2012)

gosha said:


> We were going to adopt from one of the private shelters, but their process was so long and on almost every cat's ad it said no children under 7 or dogs. We are good family and we take good care of out pets but we had no time for multiply visits to and from the shelter, jumping through hoops and we wouldn't lie about children or dogs. My fiance has 2 dogs and we plan another child in the future. I know little kitten could be trained to like dogs or children, but the shelter made it clear no dogs or children so we went to humane society and brought a kitten home the same day. While i agree there should be some sort of screening, but you can't protect every cat from evil. Just like some human adopted kids sometimes are being tortured and killed, some cats will end up in irresponsible or sociopaths hands, but majority people come to adopt with good intentions and they shouldn't be stopped.


This is so alien to me. The shelter I support has two dogs - both of whom are pets but also serve two other practical purposes - security and testing cats. The current five cats I have actually adopted from there were all adopted with the full knowledge that they would be living with Sadie (who they did know). Two of my nephew's cats came from there as well and live happily with three children!! On the other hand, there are some pens (one at the moment) that states clearly that the occupant cannot live with children or any other animals but would be perfect as an only cat). With the mother cat we failed to keep last year, she is now successfully adopted on the assessment that she was really good with children, could potentially bond with a dog but couldn't live with other cats.


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## heston (Nov 17, 2011)

I don't know where you live but there is nothing like that here in NJ. I filled out an application which included my Vet's name but there were no restrictions on what food I should feed her. I guess all States are different.


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## pattyd7 (Sep 13, 2012)

*My shelter' s policies*

The shelter that I volunteer at has no home visits, we don't have staff for that! We don't ask about brands of litter or catfood. We encourage questions both before or after the adoption. And we ask that if the adoption isn't working out for any reason, that the cat (or dog) is returned to us. We never turn away any animal.


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## cat owner again (Dec 14, 2012)

Wow! For me: this is the first time I have adopted a grown cat and one that I didn't know from people who had a cat with kittens. One of the kittens came from a feral mom that lived under our friend's country home. Her kids had handled the kittens and socialized them. I never knew about all the cats without homes until I called the feral cat coalition because of the mama and two generation of kittens that came to my attention. Then I read and researched til my eyes were sore. I believe one of her offspring is still living outside down the street but I have the two remaining from this last litter and that's it for me. I do think that people have to be educated to the committment of an animal and realize the many years they can live. The cost of the pet and the time committment to train them to live in your home. I doubt the neighbor next door who left this mama cat here cared about that. 
All those questions might bother me too but I think some people will go for it and others not. I recently bought a beautiful cat tree on craigslist that someone had for a kitten they adopted from a no kill facility only to find out their son became allergic. They had money judging from their house and she told me she had to pay $500 to return the kitten to the facility. She did it but many others wouldn't. I worry about my future and now I have to worry how the cats will fit into that. Everyone needs to be educated on the committment of a animal. In that respect it is like adopting a child. You are taking responsibility for it.


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## atm53 (Feb 2, 2013)

The process was similar to OP when I adopted Desmond. I had to fill out an application and provide the name of two non-family references. A woman called me on the phone and we talked for about 45 minutes. She did not like my choice of vet and told me so. That was the only thing we didn't really agree on. She did not ask to come to my house. She did call my two references. She also said if I rented, I would have to provide a copy of my lease. At the time, I owned this house; since then, I've sold it and remain here as a tenant but the first thing I asked the prospective owner when he wanted me to stay as a tenant, was was he okay with the cat! Because if he wasn't, I would not have stayed.

I paid $65 to adopt Desmond. The shelter said he was neutered and had his shots. They adopt out of Pet Smart so I was able to talk with the girl who came in twice a day to feed the cats. She was more knowledgeable about the cats than the woman on the phone. I don't recall being asked about litter or food; at the store, when I picked Desmond up, I did speak w/ the woman and she told me what food he'd been eating; I continue to feed him that to this day. She said whatever litter I preferred was fine. Of course it may have helped that I had previously had a cat for 10.5 years so wasn't "new" to being a cat guardian. She told me to keep calling this other woman at the shelter to send me Desmond's vet records. That turned out to be a project. Finally the woman called me back (after I called the one I'd spoken to on the phone and said I was having a problem.) This third woman (the records lady) gave me a big long speech about how busy she was, etc., but the fact remained, I had no health records for my cat. About all I got out of that conversation was the name of the vet they had taken Des to, when they first took him in. The records lady was annoyed that I wanted to make a vet's appointment because he had just been there - I guess he'd only been at the shelter less than 2 months. Quite frankly, this made me uncomfortable, but I called that vet and ascertained that they did indeed have records for Desmond. Since my g/f uses this vet for her cat, and likes her, I decided just to keep taking Desmond there. But I felt as if the shelter was holding his health records hostage, b/c they didn't want me to go to the vet I had first said I would use. Several months later, we had a flood in this area and a lot of people had to go to shelters. They were saying on the radio that you could bring your pets but you had to have their shots records and I had nothing. Fortunately my area was not flooded but it made me really angry that I didn't have those records. I was relieved when Desmond had his first visit w/ the new vet b/c now I have his rabies tag, etc. That was the one thing that really made me angry w/ this particular shelter. They did say they would take Desmond back, if I ever needed to surrender him, but from what I understand, they are no longer in operation. But that's beside the point.


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## purr machine (Dec 17, 2012)

Soo.. A few weeks later after applying to adopt a kitten from them, I received a phone call 2 weeks ago, and a lady promised to send me information, contact phone number, and available kitten list. Still no reply from them... 

I know that shelter is doing surprise visits to adopters. I live in a condo complex. One of my neighbors adopted a cat from them and received a visit from a volunteer. Interesting fact was that volunteer called my unit and asked me to open a front door for them, as they really wanted it to be a surprise, and didn't want my neighbor to have 2 extra minutes to prepare for the surprise visit.. That made me feel weird.

At the same time this shelter does not post pictures or descriptions of their cats on craigslist or kijiji, although many other shelters do that to increase the chances to find homes for their cats..

I just find in funny and very ineffective allocation of resources. 

However I am getting a kitten. And if I need to wait a few more weeks until I receive another response maybe it will not be from them.


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## cat owner again (Dec 14, 2012)

Well I don't like surprise visits. I am a responsible home owner with excellent record of keeping animals but I work from home, sometimes don't get dressed early on and don't like surprise visits. In fact I don't open my door.


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## Blakeney Green (Jan 15, 2013)

purr machine said:


> Interesting fact was that volunteer called my unit and asked me to open a front door for them, as they really wanted it to be a surprise, and didn't want my neighbor to have 2 extra minutes to prepare for the surprise visit.. That made me feel weird.


That seems over the top to me, honestly. I'm actually fine with home visits in general as I've said, but nothing that's serious enough to deny an adoption over (hoarder, squalid conditions, home meth lab, the person doesn't really live at the address they gave, etc.) could be hidden in the time it takes to buzz in a visitor.

This particular method just seems like a way to cause everyone (including neighbours) as much inconvenience as possible without actually adding any useful information to the adoption process.

It makes me wonder exactly what they're looking for. Most organizations couldn't care less if you have a bit of clutter or you aren't the best housekeeper. (Actually, many organizations get a bit nervous if your home looks _too_ perfect, because they worry you might get rid of the animal if it ever makes a mess.) They're just looking out for major problems and ways they can advise you to pet-proof.

Not even wanting to give two minutes notice... seems like taking things to an illogical extreme.



> At the same time this shelter does not post pictures or descriptions of their cats on craigslist or kijiji, although many other shelters do that to increase the chances to find homes for their cats..
> 
> I just find in funny and very ineffective allocation of resources.


Yeah, I have to agree. I'm coming from a point of view where I think home visits are helpful and reasonable, _but_ if doing them is interfering with more basic functions like maintaining an online presence for their adoptable animals... well, they have every right to run their organization as they see fit, but I would question their priorities a bit.


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## atm53 (Feb 2, 2013)

purr machine said:


> I know that shelter is doing surprise visits to adopters. I live in a condo complex. One of my neighbors adopted a cat from them and received a visit from a volunteer. Interesting fact was that volunteer called my unit and asked me to open a front door for them, as they really wanted it to be a surprise, and didn't want my neighbor to have 2 extra minutes to prepare for the surprise visit.. That made me feel weird.


I would be highly suspicious of anyone who asked me to buzz them in for another resident. It seems to me someone from a reputable organization would not be asking other people to break the rules for them.


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## Zerafian (Feb 19, 2013)

As much as I find this process being drawn out and ridiculous on the other hand it really keeps jerks from picking up a cat on a whim and then then getting rid of it 6 months later because they are tired of it. I had a roommate in college that was like that with his pets. If there was a process like that for the things he wanted these animals would have actually been in a good home instead of with him.


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