# Moral support needed - sick fosters



## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

I took home two fosters that I'm feeling really iffy about. (They are feline leukemia neg, have first FRCP and revolution.) I want to save them but am wondering if I am doing more harm than good. Like should I let them go?  They are really skinny, came in pretty healthy and went down hill from there. Vet thinks it's stress, etc from shelter life so here we are. I am giving IV fluids and force feeding small amounts of canned cat food. They do lick up the juices a little on their own, but not enough to help them. Plus they seem to be really picky about which can of juice.This am they even started eating a bit of canned.  

I have not had to force feed a cat/kitten long term before, but have with my birds. After a bit they just start eating on their own once they start to feel better. This should be the same with these guys right? For not eating their stools are solid and plenty so far. Should I also force liquids orally since they are being given IV liquids. Maybe water with pedialyte? 

I am a worry wart, I want them to live and I am their last chance. If they do not start eating soon I will have to put them down. Tomorrow I can call the vet. And I have never felt this way about a foster before, I feel torn and unsure???


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

How old are these fosters?
Were they eating at the shelter?
I assume that by IV you really mean subQ (under the skin), right? How much subQ fluid are you administering daily? If you're administering an adequate amount of fluid subQ, you shouldn't need to administer any fluids orally ... except ...
Have you tried offering them canned food soup (canned food mixed with warm water to make it a gruel that they can lap up)? If they like gravy, they may also like gruel, and it would provide more water, as well.

There are appetite stimulants that may help get them eating (though they probably won't work if the felines are ill). I have had success with Cyproheptadine at a dose of 1/8 tablet once or twice daily for an adult cat. Higher doses of Cypro can have some very unpleasant side effects. You'd have to ask your vet for a prescription if you want to try Cypro or any other appetite stimulant.

Laurie


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

laurief said:


> How old are these fosters?
> Were they eating at the shelter?
> I assume that by IV you really mean subQ (under the skin), right? How much subQ fluid are you administering daily? If you're administering an adequate amount of fluid subQ, you shouldn't need to administer any fluids orally ... except ...
> Have you tried offering them canned food soup (canned food mixed with warm water to make it a gruel that they can lap up)? If they like gravy, they may also like gruel, and it would provide more water, as well.
> ...


They are 3 mo. And yes under the skin. 5 cc per kitten 2x day. No I did not try gruel I did heat up the food but I will try the gruel.


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

Wow, three months? That's a tough age to let them go.

Kudos and hugs to you for what you're doing, Teasha. I'm very sorry I don't have any advice - all my fosters have been healthy and I have no experience force-feeding cats or kittens.

My heart goes out to you. 

I think, if it were me, if they're still active and still eating - even reluctantly - I'd still keep trying. 

<<<hugs>>>

AC


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Auntie Crazy said:


> Wow, three months? That's a tough age to let them go.
> 
> Kudos and hugs to you for what you're doing, Teasha. I'm very sorry I don't have any advice - all my fosters have been healthy and I have no experience force-feeding cats or kittens.
> 
> ...


Thank you very much. That means a lot to me


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

According to Pfizer, the manufacturer of Revolution, it should not be applied to kittens under the age of 8 weeks. It also should not be applied to animals who are sick, debilitated or underweight. So perhaps the underweight kittens are having some sort of toxic reaction to Revolution.

As far as subQ fluid is concerned, 5 cc is a tiny amount of fluid that probably isn't making much of any difference in terms of the kittens' hydration. I know that adult cats typically receive anywhere from 75-300 cc per admin, depending on the size of the cat and the circumstances, but I don't know the appropriate amount for a 3 mo old kitten. Call the shelter vet and ask. Make sure you are using sterile needles, lines, and fluids, too. No boiled water.

Although they're really too old to need it, if they're refusing regular canned kitten food and kibble, they may be willing to lap up some KMR. Your shelter should have KMR on hand, but if they don't, you can pick some up at any pet store. If the kittens will drink KMR, you can use it to transition them to canned food by making a gruel with warmed canned food and KMR.

Laurie


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

laurief said:


> According to Pfizer, the manufacturer of Revolution, it should not be applied to kittens under the age of 8 weeks. It also should not be applied to animals who are sick, debilitated or underweight. So perhaps the underweight kittens are having some sort of toxic reaction to Revolution.
> 
> As far as subQ fluid is concerned, 5 cc is a tiny amount of fluid that probably isn't making much of any difference in terms of the kittens' hydration. I know that adult cats typically receive anywhere from 75-300 cc per admin, depending on the size of the cat and the circumstances, but I don't know the appropriate amount for a 3 mo old kitten. Call the shelter vet and ask. Make sure you are using sterile needles, lines, and fluids, too. No boiled water.
> 
> ...


The revolution was applied upon intake and they 'seemed' fine then. And they are over 8 weeks. The fluids are IV fluids :wink I will call the vet when they open for dosage. I do have some KMR in my fridge so will try it. Thank you for your help. I will keep everyone updated.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

_*closes eyes to send good thoughts and healing/healthy wishes*_


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## librarychick (May 25, 2008)

When Jitzu was really sick I force fed her for 2 weeks, 3 times a day. She hated it, but she did start eating on her own once she felt a bit better.

If they do start eating the cat food that would be great, she wouldn't though. I tried many many kinds of canned, and she wasn't interested. They also didn't fit in the syringe. I bought organic chicken baby food, and she started taking her meals better. Then she started eating it off a spoon, then from a bowl...ect.

IMO when they are that sick it's more important that they eat, find something that they'll eat and go from there. With picky kittens I have been known to sprinkle KMR powder on top of canned to get them eating, it works great.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

I did make up a small bowl of KMR and at first they acted really excited, but then did not eat much. But more than before. After they were done I mixed it with canned just to see how it would go and they were not impressed. I guess I just have to keep going at it, but everything I try it seems if they do go for it they eat a bit and that's it. They've responded best to tuna that a staff member gave them, but since reading it's bad for them I'm afraid to give it. I'm afraid to weigh them today they keep losing since I started weighing. Vet has not called back, I think I will call another.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Where are you located. I'm in MN, too (northern MN), so if I can help, I will.

Tuna is OK if it's all they will eat for now, but you might also try some raw chicken or other raw meat. When I rescued the GoBoys last summer as very skinny, abandoned 5-6 week old kittens, I couldn't believe how voraciously they ate raw meat. It was pure instinct.

If your kits are dehydrated, which sounds likely if they're not eating or drinking, that may explain their lack of appetite. Dehydration can make them feel really sick and inappetant. You need to get in touch with another vet ASAP and find out the appropriate amount of fluid for subQ administration to young kittens. You also need to syringe feed those babies so that they get adequate nourishment in their systems.

I assume you're also aware that young kittens won't eat and can't properly digest if they're cold, so make sure you're keeping them snuggly warm.

Laurie


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

laurief said:


> Where are you located. I'm in MN, too (northern MN), so if I can help, I will.
> 
> Tuna is OK if it's all they will eat for now, but you might also try some raw chicken or other raw meat. When I rescued the GoBoys last summer as very skinny, abandoned 5-6 week old kittens, I couldn't believe how voraciously they ate raw meat. It was pure instinct.
> 
> ...


Hi I am in Central MN. I did get ahold of a vet. She said 10cc 3 x day. Also I have been forcing them to eat some canned food, but per your advice gave them a bit over 10 cc of KMR. How often do you suggest and how much? I knew that they cannot digest cold formula but did not know they couldn't digest because they were cold.  Anyways they are wrapped in a warm towel. They still do the eat some and walk away even with the tuna so I will keep up with syringe feeding. Right now they seem content and happy in my arms.


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## CataholicsAnonymous (Dec 4, 2006)

Kittens weak from inappetance often experience a dangerous drop in blood glucose levels, and a "dose" of corn syrup (like white Karo syrup) will boost their energy levels enough to start them eating again. I've given 10-14 day old kittens a cc (ml) of Karo; your fosters could probably use 3-5 ml. (Don't quote me on that --- I've never seen a 'dosage schedule'.) 

Some Nutri-Cal or Nutri-Stat mixed in with their gruel may add needed calories, too. And, since they seem to like the taste of tuna, you could add a little of the tuna juice in the gruel.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

CataholicsAnonymous said:


> Kittens weak from inappetance often experience a dangerous drop in blood glucose levels, and a "dose" of corn syrup (like white Karo syrup) will boost their energy levels enough to start them eating again. I've given 10-14 day old kittens a cc (ml) of Karo; your fosters could probably use 3-5 ml. (Don't quote me on that --- I've never seen a 'dosage schedule'.)
> 
> Some Nutri-Cal or Nutri-Stat mixed in with their gruel may add needed calories, too. And, since they seem to like the taste of tuna, you could add a little of the tuna juice in the gruel.


I don't want to guess and can't find anything online. Any chance you can help me out? How long does it take to work.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

I must of given them too much food, one vomited a little.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Wanting to eat, getting excited about the smell and then losing interest after just a few tastes.
I wonder if they have a kitten medical issue ... _the name is escaping me; chlamidia? herpes?_ ... something that makes blisters on the kitten's tongues and makes eating/drinking painful. Can you check their mouths?


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> Wanting to eat, getting excited about the smell and then losing interest after just a few tastes.
> I wonder if they have a kitten medical issue ... _the name is escaping me; chlamidia? herpes?_ ... something that makes blisters on the kitten's tongues and makes eating/drinking painful. Can you check their mouths?


I will check in the am. They sleep with my son and he is sleeping  I should add I noticed one was drinking by herself and they seem a bit more alert. So fingers crossed. I will be googling this though, thank you.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

You're welcome. When we took in The Trio (2bros, 1sis) all three had healing blisters on the back of their tongues and they had those scars all their lives. I wish I could remember what the vet said it was, but that was waaaaaay back in 1995.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Calici Virus?


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

You know ... that sounds familiar. That could have been what the vet told me they had.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> You know ... that sounds familiar. That could have been what the vet told me they had.


I did look and there is nothing unusual about their mouths. But I have good news  They both have a little extra energy this morning and were purring up a storm! They still won't eat on their own, but I think with a little time we will get there. I wasn't going to name them, I didn't want to get too attached. But they need names so they are Hope and Faith. One had a orangeish color by her mouth are, I'm assuming it's the KMR dried on there?


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

I think you can assume correctly. Here is a 1996 pic of Marmalade that I think has some dried milk on him.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Looks like it, Marmalade is beautiful!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

(I hope my updates are not a bother, if so let me know.) An update: When to feed and one of the girls ran over to me, drank a bit of milk out of the bowl and walked away. They are starting to fight subQ so that is also a good sign.

 I'm happy


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

I enjoy your updates and while it may seem like few are replying ... many more are reading and *learning* skills and things to try with their own kitties, too. It's all good. Update all you can! What you share today may help someone help their kitty tomorrow.
I'm glad it sounds like they are getting feisty, that IS a fabulous sign!


Marmalade was my first bottle-kitty and we had to euth him in 2008. _He was a wonderful kitty and I miss the antics he only pulled with me; jumping up and laying over my back/shoulder while I scooped litterboxes, him leaping up the wall as I made shadow-puppets for him to 'catch' and his mea-ha-ah-ah-meroop sounds he made to speak with me._ 

Here is another pic of Marmy. This was minutes after my husband brought him to me from his work and just before I whisked him out the door for the 35mi drive to the vet. I kept checking him, several times a mile, to make sure he was still breathing. On the same exam-table where our Bonnie had been euth'd just months before, Marmy received subQ fluids and his lifeless body tensed up as he whipped his head around and BIT the base of my thumb .... holding that bite until all the fluids had been put under his skin and given him a buffalo-hump. 
When he bit me, I knew he had enough fight to live and was gonna make it.
_*note the purple-blue lips as his body was shutting down in preparation for death*_


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> I enjoy your updates and while it may seem like few are replying ... many more are reading and *learning* skills and things to try with their own kitties, too. It's all good. Update all you can! What you share today may help someone help their kitty tomorrow.
> I'm glad it sounds like they are getting feisty, that IS a fabulous sign!
> 
> 
> ...


Good I am glad it is not minded  I just peeked in and said hello and one meowed and started walking to me  Yay! I do notice one is a bit more perkier than the other but that could possibly be part of her personality. Your story and photo of Marmalade gave me new hope! Those orange kitties, it seems a lot of them have spunk! I am sorry about Bonnie and Marmalade. It is so hard to lose a friend.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Here's the girls on my sons bed. I had to take off the covering. They are both siamese x. Meet Hope and Faith.










One of the girls. 










The other girl.


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## CatnipCats (Feb 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> ...Marmy received subQ fluids and his lifeless body tensed up as he whipped his head around and BIT the base of my thumb .... holding that bite until all the fluids had been put under his skin...


Heidi, you are a true cat person, letting that poor baby bite on you until the fluids were done.


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## CatnipCats (Feb 15, 2010)

Teasha, Faith and Hope are gorgeous! 

Do you know their parents? I have 2 sisters with the same coloring. Mom is a seal-point Siamese, dad is a gray tabby.


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

Teasha - love the updates! Especially since they're getting better.  And wow, those girls are totally gorgeous!! Even with the distance between us (and the six cats I already have), I was tempted!! *rolls eyes at self*

Heidi, you are my hero. What an awesomely warm and incredible story.

AC


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## Ummm (Jul 16, 2010)

What our coincidence, our local rescue (I'm in SE MN) has a 3-4months old white/cream siamese x and her name is Hope too! 

Glad to hear they're doing better!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

CatnipCats said:


> Heidi, you are a true cat person, letting that poor baby bite on you until the fluids were done.


So true, I was like what! Amazing story you have there, I LOVE stories like that.



CatnipCats said:


> Teasha, Faith and Hope are gorgeous!
> 
> Do you know their parents? I have 2 sisters with the same coloring. Mom is a seal-point Siamese, dad is a gray tabby.


No I don't they came in as strays. My Kiarah is a siamese with markings similar to theirs and I fall for her look a likes every time.



Auntie Crazy said:


> Teasha - love the updates! Especially since they're getting better.  And wow, those girls are totally gorgeous!! Even with the distance between us (and the six cats I already have), I was tempted!! *rolls eyes at self*
> 
> Heidi, you are my hero. What an awesomely warm and incredible story.
> 
> AC


We could arrange something, our adoption fees are more than generous, lol. 


Ok Now for a new update!!! I could hear someone meowing and meowing. So I figured it was feeding time. And I don't know why I thought this as they weren't eating on their own. I bring all my stuff in and set it down and Faith runs for the soft food. 

(I bring a little each time I go in even if they won't eat it, and I warm it BTW.) I have also changed up the formula, instead of water I have started pedialyte. I'm not sure if warming it wrecks it, but I figured it was worth a try. I also have unflavored pedialyte in their water bowl. I can see the difference it has made.

Anyways instead of tasting and stopping she eats like she means it. I pour a little milk next to her and she laps it all up! So I start feeding the other (Hope) and Faith will eat a little and leave and so on. 

Hope isn't doing as well, but she's alive. I am worried for her though. But if Faith can make a recovery so can Hope, it just might take more time. Although I say this I have a bit of doubt because I worry so. But she moves around, purrs and grooms herself which she didn't do as much before so this is a good sign. 

Hope and Faith take their feedings so well it's unbelievable. I did feed Faith a bit more to make sure she got enough. Faith even growled at me when I gave her fluids.  And before I left she lookes up at me and meows and acts as though she wants to stand on her hind legs to get to me. She even did a 'rub' on my hand if you know what I mean?

Anyways I'm so ecstatic I could almost jump up and down!:jump


Now to talk my mom into feeding them Saturday while I'm at an adoption event all day. She'll do it she has a big heart.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Ummm said:


> What our coincidence, our local rescue (I'm in SE MN) has a 3-4months old white/cream siamese x and her name is Hope too!
> 
> Glad to hear they're doing better!


That's kinda neat. But my girls really are Faith and Hope. Lol.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Oh AND they gained a little weight


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Faith and Hope look great! For some reason, I was thinking they were bottle-kittens ... but now I think I confused them with a different member. 
Again, I think they look great. Their eyes are showing the nictitating membrane (3rd eyelid) but they don't look lifeless. Grooming is an AWESOME sign and so is trying to follow you and rub/love on you. YAY! for eating, too! 
I love the LynxPoints! My childhood Meezer-mix wasn't LynxPoint (_though her mother was a standard tabby_) but a *very* dark russet-y brown color. Our current Meezer-mix isn't a LynxPoint either. His color is much paler though I believe it has darkened up since he came to live with us.




CatnipCats said:


> Heidi, you are a true cat person, letting that poor baby bite on you until the fluids were done.


 I'm sorry, I have to laugh! It *sounds* worse than it was ... did you see how small he was? It was only milk-teeth and all his "bite" did was leave a few light impressions in my skin. 

It is hard to lose them, but I know I cared for them and loved them well.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> Faith and Hope look great! For some reason, I was thinking they were bottle-kittens ... but now I think I confused them with a different member.
> Again, I think they look great. Their eyes are showing the nictitating membrane (3rd eyelid) but they don't look lifeless. Grooming is an AWESOME sign and so is trying to follow you and rub/love on you. YAY! for eating, too!
> I love the LynxPoints! My childhood Meezer-mix wasn't LynxPoint (_though her mother was a standard tabby_) but a *very* dark russet-y brown color. Our current Meezer-mix isn't a LynxPoint either. His color is much paler though I believe it has darkened up since he came to live with us.
> 
> ...


I know what a LynxPoint is, but what is a Meezer? Is it a Siamese? No they are not bottle feeds. They are around 3 months old. 

It does sound painful and I envisioned teeth embeded in your thumb! Still what you did way amazing and deserve recognition for it. 

UPDATE: They both gained a little weight. I use a gram scale on any sick animals I care for that I bought at Walmart in the kitchen utensil isle. Works great! Faith ate her whole meal by herself! Yay! She hates being given fluids, I think today will be the last day. Hope I had to feed, but I think she'll come around. (Fingers crossed.) I did notice HALF of the hard kitten food is gone. Later tonight I checked on them and both Hope and Faith were by the door so it seems Hope might have a bit more energy.

Tomorrow I will be at an adoption event in the cities, I'm so excited. It's gonna be fun.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Best wishes for you and the critters at the adoption event!
Yeah, 'meezer' is Siamese = 'mese = meez = Meezer. Just an affectionate name.

Great job that Faith is wanting to eat and maybe Hope will follow soon behind her. They do sound like they are both doing much better.


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

That wonderful, Teasha. Keep getting better, Hope and Faith!!!!

AC


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

The adoption event was exhausting and so worth it! We brought down 14 and came back with 5, so a very successful day. First time I was on TV.

Faith gained 2 ounces, but I think this may be because my mom may have fed them right before I came home so the weight is off. I weigh them on empty stomachs. Hope lost weight  If she continues this way we will be at the vets on Monday. She's doing ok, but no significant improvement and not eating on her own. I'm worried. Tomorrow I will try upping her feedings. Any suggestions are welcome of course


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Come on, Hope! 
When I was fighting to get my Malibu through her bout of Hepatic Lipidosis, I assist-fed an Rx canned food with high protein and fat that was made specifically for ease of syringe or tube feeding; puree'd very fine. My vet had a Hill's product but I found Eukanuba's similar product (Max Calorie) had almost twice the p'tein/fat that I felt would benefit her more per feeding. I kept it refridgerated and would warm it up slightly with hot water to make a sort of 'slurry' to feed with the syringe. 

Mallie didn't appear to care for the flavor or consistency and would not voluntarily eat it, so I syringe fed her. 
*BUT* .... I also tempted her with every known McKittyCrack. 
I didn't care *what* garbage she ate, just as long as she ATE. In the end, after less than a week of assisted-feeding, she began to show interest in nibbling the McKittyCrack I kept available. I finished the Rx can, but when it was done the rest of her recovery and eating was on her own. It took her a good 6wks to recover from that point of her first showing interest in eating again. I *think* the dry food that tempted her was like a Meow Mix or something. I began to offer her canned food meals and she would only nibble at first. I think it took a good week or so before she ate what I would consider a 'meal' of canned food.

Can you keep out a cheap cat food to tempt them and/or offer various different foods? _Even if it is junk, at least it is eating and jump-starting her appetite._


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

Smelly foods might tempt her, like fishy canned flavors, or juice from non-salted tuna or sardines drizzled over whatever you're trying to get her to eat. Also, crumbled freeze-dried treats, Parmesan cheese, or bonito flakes could be sprinkled over the food.

Fish flakes are incredibly attractive to cats, too, maybe try sprinkling that. Also, catnip works for some.

You can do it, Hope!!!!!!!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> Can you keep out a cheap cat food to tempt them and/or offer various different foods? _Even if it is junk, at least it is eating and jump-starting her appetite._


Ok so your saying instead of Purina kitten food, try some other hard foods, who cares as long as she eats. I can see what I can do. I'll try anything at this point. Do you remember the name of the special food you fed? Like there's I/D or K/D. I can look online too...



Auntie Crazy said:


> Smelly foods might tempt her, like fishy canned flavors, or juice from non-salted tuna or sardines drizzled over whatever you're trying to get her to eat. Also, crumbled freeze-dried treats, Parmesan cheese, or bonito flakes could be sprinkled over the food.
> 
> Fish flakes are incredibly attractive to cats, too, maybe try sprinkling that. Also, catnip works for some.
> You can do it, Hope!!!!!!!


 I can try. I heat up and serve canned food to her and her sister, but so far she won't touch it. 


She has NO interest in food. She has started fighting her feedings the last couple days too. I decided to up her feedings. Which means I may have to bring her to work. Which would be stressful for her.  I feel a bit lost, doesn't help I don't feel well now. But I will keep plugging away.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Oh yes and I can see Faith filling out and her coat is starting to look so much better!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi must be this? a/d® Canine/Feline Critical Care - Canned


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Hope started nibbling on the hard food and then the soft food. Woo hoo Hope!


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Awwwwww, what sweet Meezers! 
Yes, that is the Hill's Prescription a/d, but I preferred the Eukanuba Vet Diet Max Calorie.

Hills:
Protein ~ 8.5
Fat ~ 8.25

Eukanuba:
Protein ~ 14
Fat ~ 12


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## KKdaniels (Aug 23, 2010)

Oh, Teasha, you have two beautiful little babies! I know it's hard, but just try to be diligent in your fight, as I know you are, in everything you're doing for them. They are lucky they have you. You're their Mama Angel!

Keep giving updates. A lot of us can't really give advice, but we're pulling for Hope and Faith!


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## CatnipCats (Feb 15, 2010)

Baby steps, you're getting there!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> Awwwwww, what sweet Meezers!
> Yes, that is the Hill's Prescription a/d, but I preferred the Eukanuba Vet Diet Max Calorie.
> 
> Hills:
> ...


Well Hope is eating, but since it is so digestible and full of calories I picked some up from work and that is what they got as soon as I got home. Thank you for the suggestion.  So happy she is eating! 



KKdaniels said:


> Oh, Teasha, you have two beautiful little babies! I know it's hard, but just try to be diligent in your fight, as I know you are, in everything you're doing for them. They are lucky they have you. You're their Mama Angel!
> 
> Keep giving updates. A lot of us can't really give advice, but we're pulling for Hope and Faith!


Glad to know there are people out there pulling for them.  Can't wait till they get a bit stronger and plumper. Cuz their gonna get a bath! :wink



CatnipCats said:


> Baby steps, you're getting there!


It's taking forever, but it's all worth it. Thank you for your comment!


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## RowdyAndMalley (Aug 9, 2010)

Great Job Teasha! We are all pulling for you and your little loves! Please please keep us posted!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Well I weigh them every night before their last feeding and Faith is up to 2 lbs and 1 oz! But Hope went down a bit. Since she started eating I thought we were all good to go and stopped force feeding. I was wrong and now I feel guilty. So I am back to feeding her and I've decided to double the amount. Still at 3x a day giving fluids subQ. Please Hope please.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

_*thoughts/prayers for Hope*_


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

I decided not to weigh Faith anymore as she is a healthy little ball of energy  I will wait till she is at optimal weight and her sister as well before converting to all dry. 

Hope gained the 2 ounces lost? Seems odd, maybe I was too quick yesterday when I weighed her as it seems 2 ounces would be a lot to gain and lose in one day. Anyways tonight I mixed her KMR with some of the a/d diet suggested by Heidi and gave that to her. Almost out of KMR so will pick up a new can tomorrow. Hope has held on this long, I know she can make it. I wonder though why her sister took off with weight gain, etc. and Hope is still under the weather.

Does anyone know will this affect her after she is well?


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

My son comes out, mom can you clip the kittens nails she keeps playing with my feet.  Lol, if that's all I have to worry about with Faith I am happy.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

After she is feeling better and eating *well* on her own, she will gain and grow. Her body will utilize the nutrition and grow like gang-busters because of the better nutrition. IMO, unless the young cat is starved for extended periods of time during its' body-growth/development stage they don't suffer lasting (_stunted_) effects.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> After she is feeling better and eating *well* on her own, she will gain and grow. Her body will utilize the nutrition and grow like gang-busters because of the better nutrition. IMO, unless the young cat is starved for extended periods of time during its' body-growth/development stage they don't suffer lasting (_stunted_) effects.


Good to know 

UPDATE: Hope gained a bit. Is a little more active today, spending more time walking a bit instead of staying on the bed. Seems to have more life in her. I shall try some raw meat tomorrow as recommended by a member here. 

Faith is as energetic as ever.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

You know, I am *really* enjoying hearing about their progress. You have shared so much about them that I feel a connection with them (_wanting them to succeed_) and they have me cheering them on with each step you help them with.
You are doing an awesome job and it is so easy to see (_read_) how much you care for them.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> You know, I am *really* enjoying hearing about their progress. You have shared so much about them that I feel a connection with them (_wanting them to succeed_) and they have me cheering them on with each step you help them with.
> You are doing an awesome job and it is so easy to see (_read_) how much you care for them.


I am glad  Somehow it makes me feel better too. Silly I know. The last few days have been discouraging with Hope, but I must embarrassingly must admit my son turned the heat down and I don't think that helped. I talked to him and we're on the same page. So she *should* be getting better soon. Otherwise I'll need to see a vet.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

I hope she starts feeling tons better and recovers her energy FAST.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Each time I go in I bring a container with the KMR and a/d diet mixture. I'm almost out of the a/d. I allow Faith to eat some out of it and each time she drinks less each time. I also bring in warmed canned food and she is eating less of that too. So I am thinking she must be eating more of her kibble. 

Hope is moving around a bit more. I wonder about giving her more karo syrup as someone suggested. I also wonder if I am feeding enough. :? Faith pulled out of it and I am doing the same things so I wonder why Hope is not? Her progress is so slow, I feel very inadequate right now?


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

I felt the same way when I was fighting to save Malibu and had just joined CF seeking advice. Her recovery was so slow and I second-guessed myself at every step. The members here encouraged me. Kept me from losing my resolve. Just keep working towards improvement and I'm sure she'll follow along behind. Mallie took almost 3mo to fully recover from her illness and it was slow-going, but the bond between us, that was created when I fought so hard for her, is incredible. I wish the same experience for you and Hope.


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

Glad to hear Faith is still progressing, and I share your frustration about Hope. 

Question for you (and sorry if you mentioned this earlier and I've forgotten) - why are you planning to switch from canned to kibble? Typically, even the lowest quality canned product is going to have more bio-available protein, in a more easily-digestible form than even the best kibble...


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## Smittenkitten92 (Sep 22, 2010)

We had a cat who had Leukemia for four years, he did well but the last week of his life he dropped four pounds in three days. We didnt get to the IV stage but we did have to force feed him in the end. 
We put him down because he was miserable and wasn't going to come back from it that time, it was the best thing for him.
They don't get over leukemia, all you can do is give them the love they deserve and let them go before it gets to the point where their miserable and not going to come back from it and just be there for them 
Do what you know will be best for them, you are the one seeing how they feel and how their responding, you know best at this point.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> I felt the same way when I was fighting to save Malibu and had just joined CF seeking advice. Her recovery was so slow and I second-guessed myself at every step. The members here encouraged me. Kept me from losing my resolve. Just keep working towards improvement and I'm sure she'll follow along behind. Mallie took almost 3mo to fully recover from her illness and it was slow-going, but the bond between us, that was created when I fought so hard for her, is incredible. I wish the same experience for you and Hope.


 Makes me feel a little better. Thank you.



Auntie Crazy said:


> Glad to hear Faith is still progressing, and I share your frustration about Hope.
> 
> Question for you (and sorry if you mentioned this earlier and I've forgotten) - why are you planning to switch from canned to kibble? Typically, even the lowest quality canned product is going to have more bio-available protein, in a more easily-digestible form than even the best kibble...


I was planning to because I had always been told kibble is better. laurie has since told me otherwise and sent me links to different sites. So I am reading on it. It has opened my eyes for sure. And was going to post a thread with questions, soon. But with the girls I will probably still convert to kibble as most people feed it. But I will most definatley pass on this info on to the new owners and encourage them to feed canned. I just feel if I do not convert them, the new owners may try to feed kibble and they are starving from not eating it. Make sense?


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Smittenkitten92 said:


> We had a cat who had Leukemia for four years, he did well but the last week of his life he dropped four pounds in three days. We didnt get to the IV stage but we did have to force feed him in the end.
> We put him down because he was miserable and wasn't going to come back from it that time, it was the best thing for him.
> They don't get over leukemia, all you can do is give them the love they deserve and let them go before it gets to the point where their miserable and not going to come back from it and just be there for them
> Do what you know will be best for them, you are the one seeing how they feel and how their responding, you know best at this point.


We're not there yet.  I still have hope for my Hope. She doesn't have any diseases, just not eating yet. I do know where you are coming from though, I do. Thank you for your comment and support. Sorry for your loss.


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

teasha said:


> Makes me feel a little better. Thank you.
> 
> 
> I was planning to because I had always been told kibble is better. laurie has since told me otherwise and sent me links to different sites. So I am reading on it. It has opened my eyes for sure. And was going to post a thread with questions, soon. But with the girls I will probably still convert to kibble as most people feed it. But I will most definatley pass on this info on to the new owners and encourage them to feed canned. I just feel if I do not convert them, the new owners may try to feed kibble and they are starving from not eating it. Make sense?


I get where you're coming from, but kibble is coated with a flavoring that cats find irresistible (to make them eat a product that is completely species-inappropriate); getting them off kibble is generally much, much more difficult than putting them on it.

Here's a site that might help you in your readings: Feline Health

Still praying for Hope and sending many, many keep eating and gaining and getting better vibes!! 

AC


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Auntie, she is saying these two cats are fosters that do not belong to her and will be going to a home found through an adoption organization. Many people here do understand about the superior benefits of raw and canned vs kibble, but in fostering situations the animals need to be cared for in as closely as possible to what their new homes would be like. If the new owners can be educated, as many people who have joined CF have been, and choose to provide a better diet than kibble that would be great. T is saying she doesn't want them to be accustomed to a specific diet that in all probability would be completely different from what new owners would feed and cause distress for the cats during that transition of new home AND new diet.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Went to town to pick up the boys (my kids) and then stopped at Walmart to pick up some supplies. My supplies included pedialyte, sardines and oysters. I read on here somewhere to try baby foods, I wasn't sure which but I have bought this for a sick ferret awhile back. So I picked up some of each. I bought the mashed meats and the finger meats. I also bought a food blender. I wanted to try sardines and oysters because they are super smelly, although in hind site probably would upset her tummy. 

I made a plate like a sampling, a little sardines, oysters and chicken fingers to start. I also made up my usual 'slop'. First I showed Hope her sample plate and she just kinda sniffed at it. Then she started EATING the chicken fingers I'd mashed! And eating and eating. She ate about two of those. Yay! So I did not force any food. She was slow about eating and seemed to pick certain pieces and once in a while I'd kinda bump the plate when she was distracted. Then she would come back and eat a bit more. I took her into the living room with me and she sat with me a bit and then I put her back in her room, she started eating a little more. I was just thinking how horribly thin she looked. 

So we are finally making progress, I think. The only real changes that may have helped is putting more food in her tummy and I gave her more karo syrup. I'm so afraid to be excited though, last time she stopped eating.

(I have also tried raw chicken and bacon which both kittens put their nose up at, tonight I will try another meat of some kind.)


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

_*fingers, noses, whiskers and toes-es crossed for Hope*_


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

The final feeding of the night: She sniffed at the chicken but would not touch it. I mixed my formula and a/d thicker, thinking maybe she is just not getting enough nutrition. I also added the baby food chicken and karo syrup. 

Her weigh in says she lost 2 ounces. Very discouraged. Why is she losing and gaining? Maybe when I 'think' her stomach is empty it's not, but I hope tomorrow it is back up. I am very heartbroken right now. What am I doing wrong? I think I am going to keep mixing her formula thicker and try to feed her more. How much do you feed your 3 month old fosters, in cc's?

Any thoughts are welcome.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Oh gosh. I can see the benefits of daily weighing for monitoring purposes, but I also see where that can be a detractor that would discourage you with every dip in the process.

When I force-fed Mallie, I think I fed her 15-20ccs every 3-4 hours. 
Looking through my Malibu topics, I found where I said I got about 12-15ccs/feeding @ 3-4hr intervals except for while I slept at night.

I searched for my Malibu topics:
http://www.catforum.com/forum/38-he...y-vet-tomorrow-am-would-like-more-advice.html
http://www.catforum.com/forum/38-health-nutrition/102484-hepatic-lipidosis.html
http://www.catforum.com/forum/38-health-nutrition/102562-i-dont-think-im-doing-well-enough.html
http://www.catforum.com/forum/38-health-nutrition/102668-i-think-malibu-mend.html


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> Oh gosh. I can see the benefits of daily weighing for monitoring purposes, but I also see where that can be a detractor that would discourage you with every dip in the process.
> 
> When I force-fed Mallie, I think I fed her 15-20ccs every 3-4 hours.
> Looking through my Malibu topics, I found where I said I got about 12-15ccs/feeding @ 3-4hr intervals except for while I slept at night.
> ...


Thank you for the links. It is distracting when I feel no progress or it's stops and goes. I feed her 3 times a day, any more than that I will need to bring her to work. I started at 12 cc and have upped it to 36 cc. Is that too much do you think?


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Mmmmm ... how big is 36ccs? If it looks like it'd be bigger than a kitty stomach, I wouldn't feed that much. Mouse-size or a little bigger is about right.
Mallie's issues required enough nutrition to halt, reverse and replenish the damage HL caused and she had to be overfed to surmount all of those challenges. 
I think Hope needs to have enough to recover and thrive, so I would say three mouse-sized meals a day would be an absolute minimum and if you could increase that to 5 mouse-sized meals a day, that might be better to help her recover faster with more nutrition to utilize. 
You may be able to accomplish that by feeding her 1.5 mouse-sized meals 3x/day because that would equal 4.5/mice/day. 

_...I'll have to go look at my syringes and see if I have one w/ 36ccs..._


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

I got worried I wasn't feeding enough at 10cc. Well I was reading online a kitten at 3? weeks eats more than 10 cc so that's why I increased it. From your description I am feeding too much. Luckily I've only done it a few times. I can bring her to work to feed more, but worried it would stress her out more. Now I feel bad, I was overfeeding her.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Don't feel too bad. Cats can over-eat by themselves, too. A couple extra-large meals didn't kill her and it *did* get vital nutrition into her, so it's still good!


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## CataholicsAnonymous (Dec 4, 2006)

36cc equals about 1.2 ounces. At her age (and growing and active), she could easily eat several meals that size. It would take about five 36cc 'meals' to equal a 6-ounce can of cat food.


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## Mom of 4 (Jul 29, 2006)

5 cc = a teaspoon

Is There anyway to up the feedings to 4 tmes a day? Is coming home for lunch a possibility?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I would feed 30 cc every two hours during the hours when you're home on workdays. If you can get up early enough to feed her twice before you leave for work, that'd be great. Then feed her three more times between the time you get home and the time you go to bed, if possible. On days when you don't work, space the feedings out to every 3-4 hrs, instead.

When trying raw meat, do NOT offer meats that have been seasoned or brined like bacon, ham, sausage, hot dogs, etc. Choose plain, unseasoned, unbrined meats. If Hope doesn't like raw meat, you can try frying it in a little unsalted butter then letting it cool to mouse body temp.

Hope needs more calories getting into her little body in order for her to start to thrive. You're doing a great job so far, but I think you need to pick up the pace of her feedings and total daily caloric intake.

Laurie


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

CataholicsAnonymous said:


> 36cc equals about 1.2 ounces. At her age (and growing and active), she could easily eat several meals that size. It would take about five 36cc 'meals' to equal a 6-ounce can of cat food.


Whew! 



Heidi n Q said:


> Don't feel too bad. Cats can over-eat by themselves, too. A couple extra-large meals didn't kill her and it *did* get vital nutrition into her, so it's still good!


After thinking this through, she is not gaining on what I am feeding, in fact she's lost weight. I think I do need to keep her meals extra-large for now. When it's mostly soup won't it go through the body faster than canned?



Mom of 4 said:


> 5 cc = a teaspoon
> 
> Is There anyway to up the feedings to 4 tmes a day? Is coming home for lunch a possibility?





laurief said:


> I would feed 30 cc every two hours during the hours when you're home on workdays. If you can get up early enough to feed her twice before you leave for work, that'd be great. Then feed her three more times between the time you get home and the time you go to bed, if possible. On days when you don't work, space the feedings out to every 3-4 hrs, instead.
> 
> When trying raw meat, do NOT offer meats that have been seasoned or brined like bacon, ham, sausage, hot dogs, etc. Choose plain, unseasoned, unbrined meats. If Hope doesn't like raw meat, you can try frying it in a little unsalted butter then letting it cool to mouse body temp.
> 
> ...


I will try this, I have to do something. I am trying pork tonight, but to be blunt I think she feels too sick to eat. 

And I feel horrible. She has lost weight in my care not gained. There are times she gained a little but not enough to matter. She still has the will to live and loves to be with people. Right now I am feeding a KMR formula mix with canned food and a little karo syrup. Would feeding canned be better? I feel pretty much feel lost right now and discouraged. I think you are right though the food leaves her system faster than it has to work. The more times I feed the better.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

So I just put slightly cooked pork chops by Hope. (They were frozen and had to defrost.) And she is eating like a champ.


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

3 Pieces left till she finished the piece I gave her! Laurie I wish I would of tried pork earlier! Hopefully she likes it for longer than one meal, the chicken fingers were a hit too and wore off. But she is really going at it!!!


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Excellent! So she likes pork. That's a great discovery. Try frying up some chicken or turkey thigh meat. The dark meat tends to be more flavorful than white meat. If you can get your hands on any venison, that's a favorite meat in my household. If you can buy some beef on sale, you could try that, too.

You never know which meats will appeal to which felines or how quickly they might get bored with a particular type. In Hope's case, it seems that the trick is to keep offering her a wide variety and just let her eat whatever she's willing to eat (raw or cooked meat, canned food, KMR, or even kibble). The bottom line for her is that she MUST eat. That's more important than what she eats right now. Just get calories into her one way or another.

That said, I would ditch the Karo if I were you. Sugar has no place in a feline diet. Stick to high protein and moderate fat, and minimize the carbs.

Laurie


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

laurief said:


> Excellent! So she likes pork. That's a great discovery. Try frying up some chicken or turkey thigh meat. The dark meat tends to be more flavorful than white meat. If you can get your hands on any venison, that's a favorite meat in my household. If you can buy some beef on sale, you could try that, too.
> 
> You never know which meats will appeal to which felines or how quickly they might get bored with a particular type. In Hope's case, it seems that the trick is to keep offering her a wide variety and just let her eat whatever she's willing to eat (raw or cooked meat, canned food, KMR, or even kibble). The bottom line for her is that she MUST eat. That's more important than what she eats right now. Just get calories into her one way or another.
> 
> ...


Ok karo is gone  I used it because someone suggested it earlier to boost her energy level. And yes right now I don't care what she eats! I think she prefers cooked as she wouldn't touch anything raw. I'm so happy right now!


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Come oooooonnnnnnnn Hope!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Lunch time it was baby beef  Ate more than half a 2.5 oz size jar by herself.


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## Auntie Crazy (Dec 10, 2006)

teasha said:


> Lunch time it was baby beef  Ate more than half a 2.5 oz size jar by herself.


Whoot, whoot! :love2


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

_*jumps up/down in excitement while clapping my hands*_


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Auntie Crazy said:


> Whoot, whoot! :love2


 I hope it goes as well when dinner is done, she's going to have steak. I think :? Lol!



Heidi n Q said:


> _*jumps up/down in excitement while clapping my hands*_


You crack me up. I love it. :love2


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

*Steak...*


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Mira! She is so beautiful! I'm glad she's eating, she looks ...tired?... in those pics. Eating and hydrationg will help her feel so much better. 
Where there is life, there is hope. You are doing a great job! ...and I wanna come have dinner at YOUR house tonight. Steak! Woot-woot!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Heidi n Q said:


> Mira! She is so beautiful! I'm glad she's eating, she looks ...tired?... in those pics. Eating and hydrationg will help her feel so much better.
> Where there is life, there is hope. You are doing a great job! ...and I wanna come have dinner at YOUR house tonight. Steak! Woot-woot!


She is tired and weak, but she has started eating on her own. I'm thinking she's very picky. She wouldn't eat left over pork. I am still doing sub-q and I seen her going to the water bowl multiple times today. She started out eating and then soon laid down to eat with her paws on the plate, it was so cute.

Lol sure you can come over  Tomorrow we're having liver. Haha J/K. :smile:

Since she is eating meat now, should she still eat every few hours as suggested. Won't the meat take longer to digest?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

She's still weak and underweight. Yes, she should still be fed every 2-3 hrs. Gotta keep those calories going in.

Don't feed more than a little liver each day (about a dime-sized piece). It can give her the runs. Liver is also very high in vit. A, which can be toxic at high levels. Liver is very, very good for her, but only in small amounts.

Laurie


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## CataholicsAnonymous (Dec 4, 2006)

I may have missed it, but has she had a fecal test for parasites?


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

teasha said:


> Since she is eating meat now, should she still eat every few hours as suggested. Won't the meat take longer to digest?


 I think food goes in and comes out at the same rate, no matter what it is. It all depends on the individual's transit-time. I'd keep feeding her up, she needs all the extra she can get to help her recover.

Sorry, can't make it to the liver-dinner. :mrgreen:


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## CatnipCats (Feb 15, 2010)

Yay for Hope!


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## Ummm (Jul 16, 2010)

I kept meaning to post a picture of Hope from my local SE MN rescue (she was adopted last week though!)










Glad to hear your Hope is doing better and eating!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

laurief said:


> She's still weak and underweight. Yes, she should still be fed every 2-3 hrs. Gotta keep those calories going in.
> 
> Don't feed more than a little liver each day (about a dime-sized piece). It can give her the runs. Liver is also very high in vit. A, which can be toxic at high levels. Liver is very, very good for her, but only in small amounts.
> 
> Laurie


I did keep the two hours, just wasn't sure if the meat would take longer to digest than a soup.



CataholicsAnonymous said:


> I may have missed it, but has she had a fecal test for parasites?


Both girls have been treated for worms, ear mites, fleas etc. 



Heidi n Q said:


> I think food goes in and comes out at the same rate, no matter what it is. It all depends on the individual's transit-time. I'd keep feeding her up, she needs all the extra she can get to help her recover.
> 
> Sorry, can't make it to the liver-dinner. :mrgreen:


I did keep up with the feedings. But it has not helped.




Ummm said:


> I kept meaning to post a picture of Hope from my local SE MN rescue (she was adopted last week though!)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


She's beautiful.

UPDATE: 

She had chicken for dinner and didn't eat much, seems a lot weaker. She did eat her beef baby food. I also fed her the formula and prescription food mix. I think I'm losing her. I haven't weighed her tonight but last time I did it went up. I'm going to call the vet in the am and get an appointment see what they say again, but I think I need to let her go.  Trying to find someone to work all day for me, but either way I will leave to see a vet.

I don't understand the night and day difference between her and her sister. There must be some under laying problem of some sort. FIP? (I once had siblings where one had FIP and the other did not.) I feel disappointed, sad, and let down. By me. I don't lose fosters. She appeared to be doing so much better... I am so close to crying right now... She is on my bed on a heating pad. She'll stay with me tonight. I'm sorry everyone.


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## RowdyAndMalley (Aug 9, 2010)

So sorry  Hoping for good news from the vet. Have they run any tests to see if she has any parasites, or did they just do a blanket treatment? When we brought Malley home from the shelter she had diarrhea for the first month, they treated her for several things and finally it went away. Since then she has gained a substantial amount of weight and seems much more healthy and happy. See if they can run some more tests before letting her go.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Oh! atback

I had really banked on hydration and feeding being the combination that would push her back from the edge. The only thing I could suggest would be a bloodtest to see what is going on inside ... and it could either pin-point the problem and provide a clear direction for treatment, or it could reveal an insurmountable issue that would precipitate letting her go.
You've done your best. You TRIED. There is *something* that is preventing success with her and I am *certain* that something ISN'T you. You've been wonderful for her, whether she's responded or not, because you've cared/loved her!


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## DevonsOhMy (Sep 23, 2010)

I just read this full post - I'm inspired by your effort and for you love for this little foster. Working in health and living in a developing country, I see a lot of the worst and seemingly hopeless sides of humanity. But you guys remind me just how wonderful the human species is. Teasha - regardless of the outcome, not one of us could ask for more than to be loved, cared for, and to know that when our time comes we will be mourned. You're giving your all for this little girl, and she knows it. 

And it makes my day better to read how so many people feel concern and compassion for this fragile little life. I guess you could say that Hope and her story (and her supporters) give me 'hope'. 

Thank you for sharing this (and how wonderful a thing the internet is - that good people the world over can connect over small but important things,...). I, too, will be hoping for the best for Hope! (and Faith)


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I am so sorry for you and little Hope, but things may not be as dire as they seem at the moment. When recovering from a state of malnutrition, animals are at risk of developing refeeding syndrome. This is where a sudden influx of food can dangerously throw the body's electrolytes out of balance. This can be counteracted medically, however, so if this is what's happening to Hope, the vet should be able to give her whatever is necessary to rebalance her electrolytes. Of course I don't know how much veterinary expense the shelter is willing to absorb for Hope, but I do hope they will pay for bloodwork to see if Hope's current condition is reversible.

I can tell you that for the first couple of weeks after I rescued the GoBoys (5 week old emaciated kittens) last summer, they were making me absolutely crazy with their "one step forward and one step back" health swings. One day they'd eat like little piggies and act all energetic and vibrant, and the next day they wouldn't want to touch food and act depressed and weak. It took a while for their bodies to adjust to regular meals. It's possible that Hope's body was just overwhelmed by all the pork and chicken fingers she ate over the last few days. Bloodwork will tell you if the sudden food intake increase threw her body chemistry out of whack.

Of course there's always the possibility that Hope does have an underlying medical condition that is not fixable or manageable. If that's the case, the only humane option is to let her go. Again, bloodwork may offer the answers you need in order to make the best decision for her.

I wish for the best possible outcome for little Hope, whatever that may be.

Laurie


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

_*thoughts/prayers*_


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Last night Hope laid next to me on a hot water bottle. I cried and had a fear of the worst, it was hard to sleep. Sometime during the night I heard crying and woke up. I found Hope under my bed. I refreshed her water bottle and put her back on it. I thought she would be gone by morning. She was that bad. It was hard to go back to sleep, but I had to. In the morning before I even made it to the vet she passed. I feel so guilty. She always seemed to start to do better and so I thought a vet wasn't necessary as her sister bounced back. I was wrong. I only shared this story as I truly felt she had a chance, I am sorry to have dragged you all into it. 

*But I must say I appreciate all the suggestions, comments and well wishes from everyone. Your help and support means the world to me. You all made this easier for me. Thank you.*


*Rest in Peace Hope* - I really miss her, even though I only had her 2 weeks and I loved her. I don't lose many fosters so this is very hard for me. Especially since I spent so much time with her. 

*Faith* - is doing especially well. Of course since Hope is gone I worry but I am also confident she will stay healthy. I will keep her here until I am ready to let go of her. I just had to shoo her off the counter so you can see how well she really is. She is full of life and fun naughtiness. I will tell her new family of her ordeal so they have a history. In the meantime she is safe here with me. I will be especially overprotective. 




Heidi n Q said:


> Oh! atback
> 
> I had really banked on hydration and feeding being the combination that would push her back from the edge. The only thing I could suggest would be a bloodtest to see what is going on inside ... and it could either pin-point the problem and provide a clear direction for treatment, or it could reveal an insurmountable issue that would precipitate letting her go.
> You've done your best. You TRIED. There is *something* that is preventing success with her and I am *certain* that something ISN'T you. You've been wonderful for her, whether she's responded or not, because you've cared/loved her!


I wanted to send special thank you's to you Heidi as you commented everyday with inspiration or a little up lifter. Everything you posted helped me in one way or another, even if to know someone was following along. Thank you so much.



DevonsOhMy said:


> I just read this full post - I'm inspired by your effort and for you love for this little foster. Working in health and living in a developing country, I see a lot of the worst and seemingly hopeless sides of humanity. But you guys remind me just how wonderful the human species is. Teasha - regardless of the outcome, not one of us could ask for more than to be loved, cared for, and to know that when our time comes we will be mourned. You're giving your all for this little girl, and she knows it.
> 
> And it makes my day better to read how so many people feel concern and compassion for this fragile little life. I guess you could say that Hope and her story (and her supporters) give me 'hope'.
> 
> Thank you for sharing this (and how wonderful a thing the internet is - that good people the world over can connect over small but important things,...). I, too, will be hoping for the best for Hope! (and Faith)


Wow you just read the whole thing? That was a lot of reading. I did not expect this little thread to grow so much or to be read as much as it has. I am glad that it has gave you hope. Thank you for caring, your kind words and for reading this. 



laurief said:


> I am so sorry for you and little Hope, but things may not be as dire as they seem at the moment. When recovering from a state of malnutrition, animals are at risk of developing refeeding syndrome. This is where a sudden influx of food can dangerously throw the body's electrolytes out of balance. This can be counteracted medically, however, so if this is what's happening to Hope, the vet should be able to give her whatever is necessary to rebalance her electrolytes. Of course I don't know how much veterinary expense the shelter is willing to absorb for Hope, but I do hope they will pay for bloodwork to see if Hope's current condition is reversible.
> 
> I can tell you that for the first couple of weeks after I rescued the GoBoys (5 week old emaciated kittens) last summer, they were making me absolutely crazy with their "one step forward and one step back" health swings. One day they'd eat like little piggies and act all energetic and vibrant, and the next day they wouldn't want to touch food and act depressed and weak. It took a while for their bodies to adjust to regular meals. It's possible that Hope's body was just overwhelmed by all the pork and chicken fingers she ate over the last few days. Bloodwork will tell you if the sudden food intake increase threw her body chemistry out of whack.
> 
> ...


Hi Laurie I would like for you to sometime explain refeeding syndrome, if you don't mind. I also wanted to thank you too as you were there for me too. You helped me through your PMs and your personal success story. It is a very inspiring story. You are a very kind and thoughtful person and you helped me a lot. Thank you.




( Yesterday before I came home when I thought Hope was doing better I decided to bring home a mom and 6 kittens. I thought of not after she died, but they have no where else to go. I asked another foster and she said no. So I cleaned up my room and I now have a mom and 3 week old babies. I will introduce them when I am feeling better if anyone is interested. I have fostered many litters of kittens so I am not worried about the outcome. )

Thank you everyone. -Teasha


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## Ummm (Jul 16, 2010)

I am so, so sorry   Know that she was loved!

And please I'd definitely want to know more about your new kitties! I'm new to cats (just adopted two in July), they're already adults (1.5 yo, and 2-3 yo) but want to learn more if we ever decide to foster...


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## RowdyAndMalley (Aug 9, 2010)

Soo soo sorry . I know how much love, time and effort you put into miss Hope. Take comfort in the fact that the last few weeks of her life was full of love and compassion, and you were the vessel for both. Good luck on your new fosters! Please please keep us posted, it is so good to see good people do great things for other animals.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

RowdyAndMalley said:


> Soo soo sorry . I know how much love, time and effort you put into miss Hope. Take comfort in the fact that the last few weeks of her life was full of love and compassion, and you were the vessel for both. Good luck on your new fosters! Please please keep us posted, it is so good to see good people do great things for other animals.


Oh, man! atback Not much to add, but I know you did your best and I am feeling your loss in my heart, too. Gentle ((hugs)) for you.

When I joined w/ Malibu's problem, it was the little encouragements that helped me the most so I try to do the same. _I really feel that many people, especially people new-ish to cats/kittens just need to feel someone is listening and rooting for them, in order for them to find the confidence within themselves that they *are* doing the right things for their pets._ I just want to be part of the encouragement and cheering section, whether the person is new to kittehs or an experienced catter. I am glad I was able to help you in that department.


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## DevonsOhMy (Sep 23, 2010)

A much better ending than she would ever have had without you. I hope that amongst the other emotions you are feeling that a sense of peace, for easing her out of this world with love and attention and comfort, and a sense of happiness, that little Hope left the world with memories of chicken and liver and warm water bottles and warm beds, are in the mix.


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## CatnipCats (Feb 15, 2010)

I'm so sorry about Hope. Paraphrasing the others, you tried your best and at least she died in a safe and loving home. 

Good luck with the new fosters, can't wait to see pics. <Hugs> to you!


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## teasha (Aug 15, 2010)

Thanks everyone. Really wish there was a karma system here, I would use it. I do feel better today. I am glad I was able to save one. Faith is such a little sweetheart. Now she begs when I eat, lol. Comes up to me purring and jumping on my laptop. I'm thinking she is ready for her new home anytime now, but want to make sure.


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