# I am too worried about him



## donnanaguib (Mar 17, 2009)

hello everybody, 

I sent my male cat to friends in Quebec to raise him ... I don't want him to be fixed ... his new family don't mind that he mates but they don't want kittens ... can anyone help me find an infertile female to adopt for him? i mean i want a female who mates, or can allow him to mate with him but she's infertile (cannot get pregnant) ... does anyone has this female for sale or adoption? It can be from any breed, not necessarily the same as his breed ... would u help me find her? i know he can mate with someone else's female and we don't have to worry about the kittens but i'd prefer an infertile female so that she can live with him and he can mate with her whenever he wants ... the family who has the cat now is a very good family and they will give her enough care .. i sent them my male coz i know how much they love cats ... can anyone help me?


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

*cough* irresponsible *cough*

I am very, very sorry, but this has to be one of The Most Ignorant Things I've ever heard. What is the POINT of having a male cat whom you want to be able to breed, but you do not want to have any kittens from? You think it is okay for him to go out and breed *anything* outdoors, because it is someone *_else's problem_* if the cat gets pregnant? What if that bred female cat is young? Homeless? Feral? Has genetic defects? Your male has to *fight* other tomcats and risk getting deadly diseases and life-threatening abcesses?

The problem with leaving cats entire (_un-spayed/neutered_) is not only one of the dangers encountered when roaming for mates, pregnancy, birthing and raising litters in our world that has a cat overpopulation problem and are euthanized every day in staggering numbers in shelters everywhere...but also one of hormones controlling their bodies and instinct demanding specific behaviors from them in a never-ending cycle. This also increases their risk for specific cancers, specifically because of the hormones regularly changing their bodies back/forth. Cancers of the sex organs; testes, uterus, cervix and mammary glands.

Best of luck to you, but I would certainly *not* assist you in your search because I do not agree with your plan.
Heidi


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## donnanaguib (Mar 17, 2009)

I think it's very very impolite on your part to use the word "ignorant" to describe me ... plus, my cat doesn't go out to hurt the young feral cat you are talking about, so you are the ignorant one who speaks without knowing much about the topic ... why do u talk about neutering in the breeding section of the forum ... it's the breeding section where those who already decided to breed log in ... Additionally, my cat is of a breed that doesn't exist in Canada, and even the vet who saw him told them that's the first time for her to see this breed ... and the mom of the family who took him, told me that she "NEVER" saw a cat like him before ... add to the fact that he's of a breed that doesn't exist there, add the fact that he's VERY pretty and i am sure his kittens would be desired and won't go to the streets and shelters like u mentioned /// Ms. Heidi n, we are supposed to be here for a give and talk dialogue, not to fight and hurt one another ... please, next time save your PRECIOUS efforts and don't reply to my topics .. thank you

Note: the above-mentioned reply is for Ms. Heidi ONLY and i am waiting for any beneficial replies from other members ... will be happy to hear from you


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

donnanaguib said:


> I think it's very very impolite on your part to use the word "ignorant" to describe me...


I did not use the term ignorant to "describe" you. I said it [your plan] was one of the most ignorant things I'd ever heard. That is a crucial difference.
ig·no·rant (ignr-ent)
adj.
1. Lacking education or knowledge.
2. Showing or arising from a lack of education or knowledge: an ignorant mistake.
3. Unaware or uninformed.




donnanaguib said:


> ...plus, my cat doesn't go out to hurt the young feral cat you are talking about, so you are the ignorant one who speaks without knowing much about the topic...


Hmm. Lets discuss '_ignorance of the topic_' for a moment: If your cat, who doesn't even live with you, is allowed outside unsupervised...then you have absolutely no idea *what* he is doing...and that includes 'hurting' other cats. 
I know that. You, it appears, do not. 
As for 'young ferals' and 'being hurt', I brought this up because if your cat is allowed outside to breed unsupervised, if he *does* breed a young feral cat...what responsible person is going to be around to help her or her litter if she has trouble with their birth or difficulty raising them? If no one is there to help if/when they are in trouble, they will die. That is a direct result of irresponsible and indiscriminate breeding.
I know that. You, it appears, do not.
Please show me where I was ignorant and how much I don't know about the topic? 
..._because I believe I am fairly knowledgeable; having trapped, fostered, tamed and socialized-for-adoption numerous cats/kittens who were feral or dumped and then found around my rural property. These are only the cats I've found on MY property, in a very short section of the road I live on. I am not naive enough to believe this doesn't happen all over and I know people like me are not very common. Because of this, there are many, many more feral and abandoned cats/kittens who do not have someone to advocate for them, and I feel if you allow your cat outside to breed indiscriminately...then he, and you, are contributing to the problems that I try to "fix" every time I trap and take in a cat to help it find a better life than dying alone and unloved in a feral or abandoned existence._




donnanaguib said:


> why do u talk about neutering in the breeding section of the forum ... it's the breeding section where those who already decided to breed log in ...


I treat all responsible breeders with respect because I actually feel they are doing an invaluable service by keeping specific bloodlines of cat breeds viable and available by breeding the best examples to the best examples and spay/neutering cats of lesser breeding quality in an effort to continue to improve the breed of cat they work with and reach the breed standard ideal with their breeding program. 
Responsible breeders with valuable animals keep them contained and safe from harm. They check the health of their cats regularly and any cats bred with their cats are vet-checked for health prior to the mating. This cannot be done if the cat is allowed outside to breed with any cat it comes across, cats who may have diseases they can pass to your cat. Cats who can fight and injure your cat with puncture wounds that will supporate with infection.
I do not think this plan of yours is responsible in any way and I would be remiss in my duty to be responsible to cats everywhere if I did not attempt to point these things out for you to consider.




donnanaguib said:


> Additionally, my cat is of a breed that doesn't exist in Canada, and even the vet who saw him told them that's the first time for her to see this breed ... and the mom of the family who took him, told me that she "NEVER" saw a cat like him before ... add to the fact that he's of a breed that doesn't exist there, add the fact that he's VERY pretty and i am sure his kittens would be desired and won't go to the streets and shelters like u mentioned ///


Ah...but if he is allowed outside unsupervised to breed any in-season female cat he comes across in his travels, no one, and certainly not you, will know what cats he has bred and whether they belong to anyone or are feral nor where they will wind up; trying to survive alone, dead in a feral situation or dumped at a shelter by a person who didn't care enough to spay their female cat in the first place.
What breed is he? "Pretty" isn't a breed, to the best of my knowledge. 
Unless the cat is registered with a Cat Fancier's Association or Cat Breed Registry...he is just a cat. Most likely a beautiful cat, but without a registration certificate documenting his bloodlines and ancestry...he is just a cat who would be contributing to the over-population problem we have with domestic cats.




donnanaguib said:


> Ms. Heidi n, we are supposed to be here for a give and talk dialogue, not to fight and hurt one another ... please, next time save your PRECIOUS efforts and don't reply to my topics .. thank you
> Note: the above-mentioned reply is for Ms. Heidi ONLY and i am waiting for any beneficial replies from other members ... will be happy to hear from you


Yes, a forum *is* for give/take dialogue. 
fo·rum (fôr-em)
_1. The public square or marketplace of an ancient Roman city that was the assembly place for judicial activity and public business.
2. A public meeting place for open discussion.
3. A medium of open discussion or voicing of ideas, such as a newspaper or a radio or television program.
4. A public meeting or presentation involving a discussion usually among experts and often including audience participation.
5. A court of law; a tribunal._
I was not fighting or purposely hurting you. I was sharing my opinion of what a poor idea I think your plan is and offering facts to educate you so you could make an informed decision. I was also curious as to how you came to your decision, hence the reason for all of the questions I asked in the first paragraph of my reply, which also covered issues of safety/health for the cat. My second paragraph outlined the current cat overpopulation problem and how cats left entire are governed by their hormones and instincts, in addition to the medical dangers (_cancer_) of cats who may not be medically or genetically healthy and are bred repeatedly with no break between litters.

I can see you do not care for my factual information or my opinion. Sometimes, the truth hurts and I tried to express these facts in as gentle a way as possible. I am sorry you did not like hearing them. 
I cannot 'wish you luck' in finding the information you seek because I feel this is not a well thought out breeding plan at all and I do not agree with it.
Respectfully,
heidi


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## Xanti (Nov 4, 2008)

I have to agree with Heidi. If the cat has access to the outside this is a completely irresponsible thing to do. 

If he is kept as an indoor cat, there are still risks, as Heidi has pointed out, along with the very unpleasent spraying that will happen. The house will soon smell awful and your friend won't be able to get the smell out.

Not only that, if someone has a female cat that is infertile it means she will still go into heat...what torture this would be for her, she would have repeated heat cycles and be utterly frustrated.

If you really care about cats, you will get him fixed.


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## cmw0829 (Nov 23, 2008)

Your plan is equivalent to my finding an infertile teenage girl for my 17 year old son, so he can satisfy his urges without consequence. 

I wouldn't help you either. 

Just fix the cat and be done with it.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

cmw0829 said:


> Your plan is equivalent to my finding an infertile teenage girl for my 17 year old son, so he can satisfy his urges without consequence.


If _that_ is not The Best analogy I've ever heard, then I don't know _what_ is. 

_*I think I had that thought floating around in my subconscious, but I'd have never been able to articulate it as well as you did. You rock!_


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## TerriNye (Mar 4, 2009)

okay - well as a breeder - I think this is the most ignorant (and yes I'll call it IGNORANT!) bunch of nonsense I've ever heard. Maybe this is one of those spammers we aren't supposed to talk to.

Terri


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## gaz23g (Nov 30, 2008)

though not a breeder ditto to terri


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## Lisa 216 (Oct 25, 2004)

There is really no benefit to leaving this cat intact. Cats don't need to mate in order to be happy, well-adjusted pets.

However, there are numerous benefits to getting him fixed:

1. The current owners don't want kittens, and his ability to mate unchecked is surely causing kittens to be born. 

2. Fixing the cat is better for his long-term health (as explained in a previous post).

3. The cat will be less likely to develop behavior problems like spraying, which is a smelly mess and very difficult to stop once it begins.

4. The cat will not be out getting into fights with other intact males, yet another risk to his health.

5. The cat will be less likely to be exposed to diseases that can come with random mating.


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## my5kitties (Sep 13, 2005)

TerriNye said:


> Maybe this is one of those spammers we aren't supposed to talk to.
> 
> Terri


We have a winner!! :wink:


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

Eh, I always thought spammers tried to sell you something or link you to their sites. 
I think a "troll" is someone who deliberately tries to stir things up with known controversial topics. Not that there is much being stirred up here with *this* controversial topic...no one is riled up except the OP. Completely opposite reaction of what a troll would be after, and they did return to reply at least once.
I'm hoping the OP is just young and uninformed. I'd love it if they would consider the information we've shared and re-think having their cat neutered.


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## donnanaguib (Mar 17, 2009)

the tone of most members who replied to my topic reflects ill uncivilized attitudes .. I never allow myself to be indulged in such messes, so i am waiting for the other members to tell me their experiences and i am sure there are thousands of polite persons on the forum ... Ah, by the way, Ms. Heidi, you didn't need a quote from the dictionary coz i am much more experienced in English than what you imagine. I am an English specialist ... I am not a spammer, look at the tone with which you talk since I started the topic, you said "Your cat who doesn't even live with you", what do u know about my cat, what do u know about the circumstances under which I had to give him away and what do u know about what I did for my cat to keep him happy and safe .. I am sorry, I wouldn't make myself as mean to reply to this mess .. As I've said, I expect that the forum is full of polite civilized people who will advise and want to help ...


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## donnanaguib (Mar 17, 2009)

I have to mention that I respect Lisa 216 for her civilized way in replying ... Although I have another viewpoint than her, I still respect her coz this is what members here are supposed to do "to try to mention their opinions in a way to try to benefit the one who asks" .... She didn't leave any bad uncivilized reply or try to use a vulgar tone to hurt the others ... I asked a question and be it agree with some persons or not, it was the question that came up to my mind .. however, someone tried to use it to achieve something else related to her ... I will listen only to the members who try to benefit me or at least express their opinions ... forums are not supposed to be a place where to fight ... The one who tried to hurt me was told enough by my first reply and I don't have time to reply to any negative replies again ... I will wait for the other members' replies and will always appreciate all of them, whether they agree with my opinion or not ..


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## Xanti (Nov 4, 2008)

Ahh right, so what you want is someone to tell you it's fine what you are doing? Should have just said that in the first place, would have made things a lot easier...I think you will have a long wait though.


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## Heidi n Q (Nov 22, 2006)

donnanaguib said:


> what do u know about my cat, what do u know about the circumstances under which I had to give him away and what do u know about what I did for my cat to keep him happy and safe ..


All I know is what you told me: 
Your cat is allowed outside unsupervised so there is no way anyone can know what he is and isn't doing. _Whether he lives with you or not is a moot point as there is no responsible control over him if he is allowed out with no supervision._ You want to keep him entire to breed him, _but you do not plan to breed him in a planned and responsible way because you wish to just allow him to tomcat around, getting any/every in-season female cat he comes across pregnant, leaving people like me (rescuers/fosterers and to a lesser degree, the Animal Shelters) to clean up the mess of unwanted kittens that result from allowing unaltered pets out and unsupervised._ I do not believe you are keeping your cat safe at all if you are allowing him to remain a tomcat (_with instinctual mating urges_) who will pursue in-season female cats, fight other tomcats where the odds are *very high* that he could contract a disease and/or sustain a significant injury from any of those encounters.




donnanaguib said:


> I expect that the forum is full of polite civilized people who will advise and want to help ...


People _do_ want to help and _have_ advised:
Me: irresponsible and ignorant *idea*, facts listed.
Xanti: irresponsible, get him fixed, cruel to make a female cat remain in a constant heat cycle with no relief.
cmw0829: get the cat fixed.
TerriNye: ignorant bunch of nonsense.
gaz23g: ditto.
Lisa 216: no benefit to leaving this cat intact.
my3kitties: wondered if this was spam.
Xanti: realizes you don't want to hear what is right, only that you're right.

*you have a handful of people here, right now, agreeing that what you are planning on doing is not a good thing. How many people will it take, disagreeing with you and saying _'this is a bad idea'_, before you stop and think "..._maybe this isn't a good idea_?" and consider changing your plan?





donnanaguib said:


> I will listen only to the members who try to benefit me or at least express their opinions ...
> I will wait for the other members' replies and will always appreciate all of them, whether they agree with my opinion or not ..


*_crickets_* 


Please accept my apologies for behaving so monstrously towards you. You are right, I could have caught more flies with honey than vinegar, though the facts remain the same and there is no changing them. Only the tone I used could have been better moderated by myself. I will keep this in mind (_being more friendly when expressing the facts_) when posting to other similar requests.
h

_If you would like more traffic from the remainder of the forum members, since many do not regularly check out the breeding forum, you could post a request in Cat Chat with a link to this topic so you get more replies._


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## bm0513 (Sep 17, 2008)

I expect that you will find the vast majority of people on this forum (I would hope all of us would be) unwilling to help you do what you are suggesting. No, we don't know any of the circumstances surrounding his transfer from you to someone else, but I would hazard to guess that even if we did know such things (or know what breed he supposedly is, since you've not yet told us) we would not support what you are doing. 
I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for someone here to help you, though as Heidi said I'm sure there will be many more people to disagree with you. 
And I personally believe everything that Heidi has said to be true.


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## marie73 (Jul 12, 2006)

I've stayed out of this because I believe you are a troll. I had to read the original post three times and still this is the only (unbelievable CRASS) thing I can gather that you are asking for:

1. You want a female cat who can't get pregnant so your cat can have sex whenever he wants.

Why is this even in "breeding"??? You don't want kittens.

This is disgusting. I hope the entire thread gets deleted.


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## doodlebug (May 13, 2006)

Opinions have been expressed, maybe not in the most sensitive manner, but very valid opinions none the less. I know of no one on this forum that would support this quest and nothing good can come of leaving this thread open any longer, so I am locking it.


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