# Waiting is so hard...



## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Last Saturday I notice my girl if 10 1/2 years wasnt eating, and she was vomiting every 90 mins. This came on suddenly and while I stayed up through the night with her, I decided I couldnt wait until Monday to take her in. My husband and I were going on vacation this next week, and have been trying to save money, but Chii is my child since atm I cant have any.

Chii is my best friend. She was my first pet when I moved out on my own, shes been by my side no matter what and has saved my life (I feel) from otherwise stupid mistakes I would have made out of depression. If I was alive, it was for her. When I got married, and we added two new cats to the family, she still, was only mine. In 10 years she has never cared for my husband, and the other cats she can care less about.

Chii has never been sick until now, and is a purely inside cat. If you know me, you know Chii. I even carry pictures of her. So when this started to happen, cost and canceling the vacation was without question.

Lately we have had some issues with Chii's attitude and the new kitten, Ive even posted here about her recently looking for some help. But what happened this past weekend was something I could have never predicted.

The ER wanted to keep her over night on fluids, and to do a series of tests. As much as money isnt really an object, we couldnt lay down over 1k right then and there, and opted to do the bloodwork first. She came back completely negative on everything so the Dr ruled it out as an upset stomach, gave her SQ fluids and we took her home where she continued to be lethargic and she was still vomiting. Watching her, unknowing... was torture.

We took her into our normal vet the next day, he looked her over, agreed that other than being lethargic and vomiting she really was still very healthy. He said to give her about another 24 hours and we would wait to see if some antibiotics for any upset stomach from the ER helped. It didnt, and we took her back the next day. They put her out and gave her bromine (sp?), which the xrays showed it was building up and taking a while to pass from the valve of the esophagus to the stomach. Herein, he thought, was our problem. He started to settle on thoughts that this is Inflamatory Bowel Disease, or an acute bought of Gastritis. He gave her a shot of Cortisone to see if it helped at all, and sent her home.

48 hours later, she still hasnt eaten or drank a thing, and shes still horribly lethargic. Chii started at 14.14lbs. She has a lot of reserves, and shes not showing any signs of a fatty liver issue. Still, we take her back for an exploratory surgery. This was Thursday, and we took her in for the next step which was exploratory surgery.

Chii is still recovering after exploratory surgery. The good news is that the Dr didnt find any masses. We still dont know what is wrong tho, and likely wont have any other ideas until the biopsy comes back. That can take up to 5 business days. We were supposed to get her back tomorrow morning, but she is still uninterested in food and water.

The Dr suggested probably keeping her until we get the test results back so she can remain on IV and heal right because she will likely still be just as lethargic and uninterested in food/water as she has been for the past week.

I feel so horrible leaving her there, but on the same hand, I am going to ask them to keep her there so she will still be getting fluids and good treatment. I need her to heal... if she can. Whereas here she still wouldnt be eating or drinking and would be just as listless.

It's so hard because I feel some of this decision is so selfish because I cant bare to sit there and watch her like that for another 4 or 5 days while we wait. Because Im not strong enough to watch her just lay there, or look out the window and not even have the energy to hold her head up, so instead she rests it on the window.

Before the surgery I already asked the Dr. to make sure she wasnt suffering or that this was more for us than her. The reality is, she still has half her life left and he said the surgery was really worth doing, and he still feels confident it wont be anything major.

The worst thing in the world is waiting, unknowing, and seeing her so sick. I might not have kids, but shes the closest thing Ive had for 10 years. Shes mine, there was always a comfort in the fact she didnt like anyone else but me. This past week has been **** and something I would never wish on anyone.

All I can do is know that shes in God's hands, and beg, even silently, that she will be okay.


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## JohnMT (Jun 30, 2010)

I know exactly how you feel. Waiting is so **** hard, especially when you don't know what is actually wrong or what to expect. Some people who don't have pets or aren't very attached to their pets can't understand how attached we get to these little balls of fur. They are our close friends... they are our family... they give us so much and are always there for us when times are tough... Seeing them sick or suffering and feeling helpless to do anything other than wait for tests to come back, or treatment for the symptoms to hopefully kick in is a horrible horrible feeling. The unknowns surrounding something like that are so hard to deal with. 

You aren't being selfish at all wanting her to be at the vets either. Her being able to remain on the IV so she gets plenty of fluids is what's best at this time. It's in her best interest to be in the care of a vet right now with what's going on with her so they can do whatever is needed to get her healthy again. You are doing the right thing.

Please keep us updated as to how things are going. I hope that your vet is able to get to the bottom of this, find the cause, and treat it soon so you'll have your Chii back to normal quickly!


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## Victoriax (Feb 25, 2012)

awwww I am really sorry to hear Chii is poorly & I send my best wishes for her recovery bless her & you x

not knowing & waiting & hoping for some good news is just awful but you have done the right thing by leaving her with the vet as she needs fluids etc to recover ~ dont beat yourself up over this you are doing the best for your baby xxxx

really preying for some good news for you & Chii xxxx stay strong x


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## ownedby4cats (Jan 23, 2012)

So sorry that Chii is going through this. She is at the right place, she's needs to keep her strength up if only by IV. My husband and I never had children either, I never really cared for kids. But our 4 cats are family and they bring so much happiness, laughter and love to our lives that I don't know what we would do without them. I hope Chii gets better soon and please keep us updated.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Thanks guys for the reassurance Im doing the right thing.... 

The vet called, and indeed we are going to keep her there. He said it looked like she vomited a little again last night. Her incision looks good, and otherwise she looks good as well. He says that shes not having any abdominal pain, swelling or tense muscles when he palpated the area. 

He says hes almost worried that the biopsy will come back negative too, in which case its still a guessing game. He says hes still pretty sure its nothing major and that he would be checking on her periodically today and tomorrow. I lamented that the hardest thing is waiting and not knowing. 

He said he could have put rush order on the tests but he didnt want them to rush any miss anything.

How can my house still feel so empty even tho my husband and two other cats are here...


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Chii is back from the vet today!

We still dont have any test results, but the Dr had told us she was getting very angry at them lately which shows her spirits have returned =) 

She still wont eat or drink, but shes a little more active and aware which is sooooo nice to see. Lets just hope the tests come back soon so we can get her interested in food and water again!

One quick question that I forgot to ask the vet... she has a bandage on her leg from the IVs... how long til we take those off?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I'm very glad to hear that Chii is home from the vet, but I'm very concerned that the vet doesn't seem to have given you any instruction on her medical management. If she isn't drinking, you should have the vet teach you how to administer subQ fluids at home to keep her hydrated (VERY important). If she still isn't eating, you should be assist feeding her at home (even MORE IMPORTANT, and the vet should have been doing the same while she was hospitalized). If she still has a bandage on her leg, the vet should have told you when to take it off.

OK, one thing at a time. The following link will provide you with information and links to tutorials on how to administer subQ fluids at home, but you will still need to get prescriptions from your vet to purchase the necessary supplies:

Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Subcutaneous Fluids

The following links will provide lots of tips, tricks, and techniques to get nourishment into your girl:

Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Persuading Your Cat to Eat
AssistFeed.com: Advice to help a sick cat who will not eat

As far as the bandage is concerned, my vets have always told me to remove an IV bandage as soon as I get home.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Actually my vet isnt as negligent as you act. She's been at the vet for 4 days, and has been on fluids and IV that entire time. Shes not dehydrated and pretty sure she wont be after one day. Shes doing a LOT better than when I first even brought her in. We've had her just over 12 hours now and Im not too fussed. Im still calling the vet in the morning to give them an update. 

Other than not eating/drinking and this gastro-intestanal issue, shes perfectly healthy, so its not as if shes on deaths door. All of her other tests are fine and its not a kidney issue, and it seems a little rash to be so pessimistic when shes been home less than 24 hours and seems to be doing much better.


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## marie73 (Jul 12, 2006)

You just got advice from one of the kindest and most knowledgeable members here who is sharing her experience and giving you great links to look into. I'm sure what you meant to say is "thank you!"


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I just reread all of your posts in this thread, and I don't see any mention of your girl having taken in any nourishment by mouth since at least May 5. There also isn't any mention of her getting anything other than IV fluids at any of the vet hospitals. That's 10 days since the last time your girl ate anything, right? I really don't mean to upset you, but a cat can't be perfectly healthy and not have taken in any nourishment for 10 days. 

I have no doubt that she feels much better having been fully hydrated while in the hospital, and I'm not at all surprised that she's not thirsty at the moment. However, if her lack of thirst continues beyond 36 hrs after coming off the IV, you should ask your vet about subQ fluids at home to prevent her from becoming dehydrated again.When were your girl's liver values last tested? 

There's a difference between pessimism and concern. I am holding all good thoughts that your girl's test results will come back with good news, or at least news of a treatable condition. But I can't help but be very concerned over her apparent lack of nourishment and the effects that could be having on her liver. I just don't want to see things get worse for her instead of better.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

laurief said:


> I just reread all of your posts in this thread, and I don't see any mention of your girl having taken in any nourishment by mouth since at least May 5. There also isn't any mention of her getting anything other than IV fluids at any of the vet hospitals. That's 10 days since the last time your girl ate anything, right? I really don't mean to upset you, but a cat can't be perfectly healthy and not have taken in any nourishment for 10 days.
> 
> I have no doubt that she feels much better having been fully hydrated while in the hospital, and I'm not at all surprised that she's not thirsty at the moment. However, if her lack of thirst continues beyond 36 hrs after coming off the IV, you should ask your vet about subQ fluids at home to prevent her from becoming dehydrated again.When were your girl's liver values last tested?
> 
> ...


Explaining it makes it easier to handle. It seemed (at least via text) that you were really just talking down to my vet, and being pessimistic about any progress/attempts to take care of Chii. But again, text can make them seem things they arent, so thank you for taking the time to explain why you were concerned so I can identify why. Just throwing me links and saying you were concerned in his lack of his job just doesnt come across as well as the reasons why. 

I get what youre saying, and really, we are at a total loss to that. Also, Im really cautious as to force anything on her without the vets take on it. We arent super experienced and I feel like Im walking on egg shells now because shes finally not vomiting and really... this whole thing 2k later and over a week has made me feel like one raw nerve. 

Um... to answer your questions her tests were run Sunday morning. I get that shes not 100%, and that our time is limited the longer it goes, trust me I cry about it every couple of hours. The vet doesnt want to seem to do anything except wait for when the tests come back (should be no later than weds) and TRUST me, continuing to not eat or drink is not an option. I was going to call him tomorrow about it anyway and tell him the same even before this thread/conversation. 

But what if the tests also come back without showing anything? We cant afford to keep poking around in the dark, nor can we just expect her to wait and waste away. Also, force feeding her/subQ is no way of life either. Talk about being between a rock and a hard spot. How long do you keep waiting, or testing, or forcefeeding? I know thats usually up to the owner, but I mean whats reasonable? 

Im afraid if we force feed her shes going to start vomiting again. Isnt that a step backward? Also... she had surgery on Thurs, could the stress of that and the tense action of the muscles hurt the incision?

But again, I planned on having the conversation with him that its been 2k and over a week later, we still know *nothing* and shes not getting any better (mostly). But .... even then I mean we cant force him to come up with something, or can we? Idk...


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns, I recognize that you are one big, frayed nerve at the moment. I'm right there with you, because I live on a farm with a boatload of animals with various medical concerns that I manage every day. The only difference is that I've been doing this for decades, so I have a somewhat more experienced perspective from which to respond. Please understand that I'm just trying to share some of my experience in the hope that it will help you help Chii.



Ktns said:


> It seemed (at least via text) that you were really just talking down to my vet, and being pessimistic about any progress/attempts to take care of Chii.


You're not entirely wrong about my attitude toward most vets. I've dealt with a lot of vets in my lifetime, and I can count on one hand (with several fingers left over) the number of vets I've dealt with who I consider to be really exceptional ... or even as knowledgeable or as good at dealing with human clients as I think it's reasonable to expect them to be. 

What I have learned about vets over the years is that they are, indeed, human. They are - as are we all - sometimes imperfectly knowledgeable, forgetful, overworked, overwrought, under-educated, and yes, frayed. Yet many of their clients (myself included) often impose an expectation of unrealistic perfection on them. That expectation has caused me a tremendous amount of frustration and anger toward vets in the past, and still does occasionally when realistic thinking evades me. 

Over the years my unrealistic expectations have been largely replaced by resolved disappointment. It has, much more productively, also been replaced by my assuming responsibility for overseeing and actively advocating for my animals' health care. This includes researching my animal's health concerns, networking with others dealing with similar animal health issues, and partnering strongly with my vets. Long gone are the days when I blindly accept everything my vets say or recommend without question or input. I question everything, and my vet and I discuss treatment and management options. We listen to each other and bounce ideas off of each other. And when all is said and done, I implement whatever treatment strategies make the most sense to me based on my own research, my vet's input, and most importantly, on what I believe to be in the best interest of the individual animal.

The point I'm trying to make here is that I feel it's crucially important for caretakers to assume active roles as advocates for their animals' veterinary care and to become partners with their vets, rather than servants to imperfect veterinary masters.

Whew! Off that little soapbox ... for now.



> Im really cautious as to force anything on her without the vets take on it.


Do I really need to get back on my soapbox again so soon? LOL! If I were in your situation, here are the things I would be discussing with the vet immediately:

1) assist feeding
2) feeding tube
3) appetite stimulants (cyproheptadine, mirtazapine)
4) antiemetics (cisapride, metoclopramide)



> to answer your questions her tests were run Sunday morning.


You mean, this last Sunday morning, 5/13? How were her liver values then? Had they changed since the last blood test? OK, another brief soapbox moment - You should always request and keep copies of ALL labwork run on your animals for any reason. Vets rarely have time to go over an animal's history during a vet visit, so it's really up to owners to keep a handle on their own animal's health status and any changes over time. Also, I can't tell you how many times a vet has told me that my animal's bloodwork was "fine" or "perfect", only to find that it was neither fine nor perfect as soon as I saw the lab report myself.



> I get that shes not 100%, and that our time is limited the longer it goes, trust me I cry about it every couple of hours. The vet doesnt want to seem to do anything except wait for when the tests come back


Channel those tears into advocacy with your vet tomorrow. No matter how good the vet is, he will never have the sort of emotional investment you have in the welfare of your cat. He also will never know your cat the way you do. At the end of the day, YOU are the one who is ultimately responsible for your cat's health care decisions. YOU make the final determinations regarding her course of treatment, and YOU are the one who implements that treatment on a daily basis. 



> How long do you keep waiting, or testing, or forcefeeding? I know thats usually up to the owner, but I mean whats reasonable?


Well, you're right, it is up to you. It's all up to you. But here are a few cat facts that may help you in your decisions. It's common for cats to stop eating when they don't feel well for whatever reason. Usually, when a cat's body recovers from whatever was making it feel oogy, the cat starts eating again. Occasionally, though, something goes funky, and the cat continues to refuse food even after the body appears otherwise healthy. In those cases, assist feeding (or even a feeding tube) can sometimes kickstart the appetite and get the cat eating on her own again. Sometimes that can happen after a meal or two, and sometimes it can take months of assist feeding before the cat miraculously starts eating again. Strange and befuddling creatures, these felines.

Of course, it's also possible that your girl may have an insidious illness that has eluded diagnosis thus far. If that's the case, she will probably become more symptomatic over time, hopefully making diagnosis and effective treatment possible.



> Im afraid if we force feed her shes going to start vomiting again. Isnt that a step backward?


There are antiemetics to control vomiting. My boy, Noddy, vomits everything he eats without his metoclopramide twice a day. Again, this is something you need to advocate for with your vet. 



> Also... she had surgery on Thurs, could the stress of that and the tense action of the muscles hurt the incision?


Feed small meals frequently. That should prevent her stomach from overfilling. I syringe feed Noddy small meals frequently throughout the day. Anything more than 40 ccs per meal makes him vomit. Your girl may need even smaller meals more frequently while she's recovering from surgery. Your vet should be able to guide you with this.



> we cant force him to come up with something, or can we? Idk...


Vets don't respond well to force. Too many of them don't even respond well to partnering or advocacy. Part of your job as a pet parent is to find a vet with whom you CAN partner effectively. If that's your current vet, great! If not, keep looking. 

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Not much time to respond for now, but this morning she drank a little on her own but when we gave her meds we also gave her about 1.5mL food and water each. We will do this again for lunch and dinner. Food being the syrup from wet food. We are getting baby food today.

Still waiting to hear back from the vet this morning. Also took the bandage off and shes still more lively than when we dropped her off. She's even grooming again. 

I'll post another update later.


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## Penny135 (Apr 6, 2011)

Glad things are looking up. Waiting to hear news from the vet.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

> Ktns said:
> 
> 
> > Not much time to respond for now, but this morning she drank a little on her own
> ...


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

okay here is the big update... I am unsure on a couple things so maybe you can shed some light for me... 

The vet called back sometime after my post and said the tests came back indicating she did have a little IBD. I told him my concerns still on eating/drinking and told him what we did today. He had me come by and pick up something called Rebound. Im supposed to give her 5ccs/mls (I dont remember the measurement to the syringe), every couple of hours. 

He said the cortisone he gave her last Tues should last 2 weeks or so given how small the IBD is. He said call him back tomorrow to see how shes done on the rebound..

My issue is this... SHES STILL NOT EATING OR DRINKING ON HER OWN!!! Lol. Its like YES we got test results but what now?! Rebound? Thats it?! 

He said something about being unsure if her getting better was because of post surgery or the cortisone. And that he did check her liver extensively when he was in there on Thurs and she was perfectly fine as far as the fatty liver issue. 

I dont know... maybe I was tired, maybe I didnt get everything... but I feel like I have 0 answers even tho the tests came back. 

I mean.. this could be normal and make sense to some of you. I just feel like Im missing a big chunk and I dont get the order of operations. Is this normal? We just keep waiting even with the tests back? 

If this all sounds good, then great! Just... can someone explain it to me please in laymans terms?


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## Nan (Oct 11, 2010)

I just looked up the product online & it's to prevent dehydration. But I don't really don't think that's enough. I think you should also be force-feeding (syringe feeding) some real food. Something high-protein like Evo 95% with a little water or Hills AD recovery.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns said:


> The vet called back sometime after my post and said the tests came back indicating she did have a little IBD.


OK, here's what I do and what I recommend to other folks who are dealing with a health issue in their pet. Join one or more online groups dedicated to that particular health issue. There are groups available online dedicated to nearly every major health concern in animals, including feline IBD. Although I am not a member of any of the IBD groups (yet), I have found groups for CRF and hyperT to be lifesaving for my cats. Folks on these lists typically and freely share information and answer questions. They become experts on their specific disease. They often consult with veterinary experts in their field, as well. These disease-specific mailing lists are what I consider to be my number one resource of current information and support. Here are links to two feline IBD lists that I recommend you join:

felineibd1 : Feline IBD group
FeIBD : Feline IBD Forum

Members of these lists should be able to answer any IBD questions you may have and provide lots of information about treatments and management strategies for you to discuss with your vet.



> He had me come by and pick up something called Rebound.


I am not familiar with Rebound, so I looked it up. The following link will provide you with information and links to additional information about Rebound and its use:

Virbac Animal Health | United States ? REBOUND® Liquid Diet

It sounds like a good first step to getting some nutrition into Chii, though I personally would be inclined to syringe feed canned slurry, as well. The IBD list members will be able to tell you which foods seem to work most successfully for their IBD cats.



> He said the cortisone he gave her last Tues should last 2 weeks or so given how small the IBD is.


Steroids are a common treatment for IBD, though I have no idea why your vet would have administered cortisone to your cat in lieu of prednisolone, which is the recommended steroid for cats with IBD. That's something you'd have to ask your vet to explain.



> My issue is this... SHES STILL NOT EATING OR DRINKING ON HER OWN!!! Lol. Its like YES we got test results but what now?! Rebound? Thats it?!


OK, broken record time. IBD is not one of my areas of expertise, so I'm going to again urge you to join the IBD lists and let them guide you through this disease's learning curve.



> he did check her liver extensively when he was in there on Thurs and she was perfectly fine as far as the fatty liver issue.


As far as I know, fatty liver can occur at any time. The fact that her liver was healthy last Thursday does not necessarily mean that her liver is still healthy today. Keep a close eye on her mucous membranes and sclera of her eyes. Any yellowing should immediately send you running back to the vet for another blood test to recheck liver function.



> I feel like I have 0 answers even tho the tests came back.


Such is often the case with medical concerns. Fortunately, though, you DO have a diagnosis - IBD - and that is something you can research and learn how to manage. Your best strategy now is to dive in and start learning everything there is to learn about this disease. It'll be overwhelming at first, but every nugget of information you absorb will get you a step closer to successful management of Chii's condition.

Laurie


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## Nan (Oct 11, 2010)

My cat Sophie had IBD and she would get anoerexic at times (not eating and throwing up). I would syringe-feed her a couple days with the Hills AD Recovery (prescription food) A couple times she start to eat it on her own then. Sometimes I had to use an appetite stimulent. Not saying that this is what you need to do, but I just can't imagine your vet not wanting to feed her real food...

The cortisone can slow the healing process from surgery, but it should also be making her feel moer comfortable.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Small update! 

Chii licked a little at the normal cat food for dinner!!!


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## Nan (Oct 11, 2010)

Yay! That is very encouraging ! :catmilk


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

It's great that Chii licked a little dinner, but it's still very important that she takes in adequate nutrition to avoid hepatic lipidosis. How did she do today on the Rebound? How much of it did you get into her?

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Today's feedings went like this:

8am - Amoxicilin, Wet Food 'juice', Water. Each at 1.5ml. Mostly because I want to make sure she doesnt vomit it all up. 

12pm - 5ml Rebound

2pm - 5ml Rebound

4pm - 5ml Rebound

By this time I took a nap because this is my first 'vacation' off in 7 months and I havent been sleeping well since Ive been so worried/caring about her. 

8pm - Amoxicilin, Wet food 'juice', water. Still each at 1.5ml. 

She (knock on wood) still hasnt vomited, and Im anxious to see if she eats tomorrow. 

My husband and I *HAVE* to leave town tomorrow for an all day thing so she will get food/water/litter in our master bedroom/bathroom while we are gone. We have put off this affair for a week and a half for her and we can no longer hold out. The vet already gave us the go-ahead (for what its worth).


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Reading the package insert for Rebound, I see that the feeding guidelines for a cat of 13-16 lbs is 255 mls/day, divided over 4-8 feedings. 8 oz=237 ml, so Chii should be getting a little over a bottle of Rebound a day in order to cover her nutritional requirements (if that's her only source of nutrition).

If she doesn't start eating substantial amounts on her own (and keeping it down) tomorrow while you're gone, I recommend you tell your vet that you want both an appetite stimulant (cyproheptadine or mirtazapine) and an antiemetic (cisapride or metoclopramide) to facilitate getting and keeping adequate nutrition in Chii before she develops hepatic lipidosis (if she hasn't already). Even if she doesn't develop HL, she can not survive on 15 ml of Rebound a day. 

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

I already know how much she needs to be taking and Ive already talked to the Dr about things to up her appetite. Sorry my answer is short, I just woke up x.x


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Okey dokey, then. I wish Chii the best possible outcome.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Chii still wouldnt take those bites for dinner. She pushes her nose to the food but then walks away after a moment or so... Ive tried canned, dry, treats, etc. 

Gave her more canned food syrup 10ml. 30ml total in Rebound today. I joined the assisted feeding forum that one of Laurie's links sent me to. I call the Dr tomorrow to give an update. 

Im at my wits end, and honestly I feel like I cant stop crying. She still has higher energy levels and is not vomiting, but every moment that passes that she wont eat kills me. Assisting her is hard as well, but its something my husband and I are doing our best at. 

Looking for anything that will help her take that first bite of food. Ill be hitting the Dr up again for appetite stimulants tomorrow.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

And odd update... just as I was going to bed, C decided to get up and be all active. 

Got up, went to her scratching pad and spent some time on it. Something she hasnt done since this started. Went out to the livingroom, groomed, gave a big ole roll on her back stretch. Ate a flake or two of wet food, tried some treats but wouldnt swallow them... maybe she has a sore throat from all of the vomiting and is too afraid for anything solid?

Anyway, went to the potty and took a poo, something else I havent seen her do in a while. Slapped Darc when he got nosey (lol) and was generally out and about. I was going to get some sleep, but I wanted to be at her every whim. Shes gone back to the closet for now so Im sure Ill go back to bed in a few mins. She seemed to be trying food a little more....omg I cant even tell you how hard I am screaming in my mind 'eat it!!!' lol.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

While it seems to me that you'd prefer not to get any more responses from me, I can't, in good conscience, leave Chii to slowly starve to death or go into liver failure when I have more potentially helpful suggestions to make. 

Chii's aversion to putting food in her mouth may be symptomatic of nausea and/or mouth/dental problems. She may have a buildup of stomach acid making her feel nauseous, in which case, 1/4 tablet of Pepcid AC (regular strength) a day should help. If you do give Pepcid, separate it from any other meds by 2 hrs so that it doesn't interfere with the other meds' absorption.

Hopefully your vet thoroughly examined her mouth while she was under anesthesia for surgery, but if he did not, that should be done. Broken or loose teeth, infected teeth or gums, mouth ulcers, all can cause cats to not want to put anything into their mouths. It's really not possible for a vet to do a thorough oral exam on a conscious cat, so you should ask if her mouth was examined under anesthesia.

If Chii is experiencing some sort of oral problem, she may be more willing and able to lap up a warm, canned food gruel that she won't have to bite at or chew. If she has a painful tooth, warm gruel (as opposed to room temp) will be less likely to irritate sensitive nerves.

I don't know why your vet isn't being much more aggressive about addressing Chii's inappetance, but you might want to consider finding a vet who will be more proactive before Chii's condition deteriorates again. Her activity last night would seem to be a very good sign and is probably the result of the somewhat greater amount of Rebound that you were able to get into her yesterday, but I can't imagine her good spirits lasting long if she doesn't get adequate nutrition.

Laurie


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## Nan (Oct 11, 2010)

Try and see if she will lick food off of your fingers. What kind of wet food are you using? (Pate style will probably be easier for her to eat at this point). Also try something smelly - like Wellness chicken & herring or something with liver in it. Make sure it's not cold. Room temp or a smidge warmed. Or a small glob on the floor, which turns it into "found food"- much more interesting than the stuff in a dish... The important thing is to getting her to start eating; you can always try to control the type of diet later.

Laurie just posted before I pressed "enter". Please listen to what she is telling you. Laurie's the best!


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

I never said I didnt want to hear from you, so where you got that idea is beyond me. My short post yesterday morning that I already apologized for in the post because I wasnt quite awake?

In any case, the vet said he did look her over orally while she was out and in xray, he said he didnt find anything. 

She did vomit last night around 3am, it wasnt really anything and shes been quiet since. I will try the pepcid, after her initial meds this morning. Is this something I can crush up and mix with water?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns said:


> She did vomit last night around 3am, it wasnt really anything and shes been quiet since. I will try the pepcid, after her initial meds this morning. Is this something I can crush up and mix with water?


Pepcid is very bitter, if I remember correctly, so I wouldn't crush it or mix it into anything. Instead, put the 1/4 tablet into a Pill Pocket (if you don't have or have never used Pill Pockets, I highly recommend them) and drop it down her throat. Alternatively, you can buy empty #3 or #4 capsules from a local pharmacy, and put the 1/4 tab in one of them. The easiest way to administer a capsule (or any pill, for that matter) is to coat it with butter, then use a pill popper to place it in the very back of Chii's mouth. Give her a cc of water immediately before pill administration to wet her throat and again immediately after pill administration to force swallowing and prevent the pill from getting stuck in her throat. If you don't have a pill popper, you can buy one from a pet store, from an online pet supply company, or probably from your vet.

If Chii is still vomiting, it's time to tell your vet that you need both an antiemetic AND an appetite stimulant for her. Don't take no for an answer. If your vet isn't willing to treat her inappetance aggressively, then you're going to have to advocate strongly enough to get the job done in spite of any reluctance on your vet's part.

Laurie


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## Lucas718 (Feb 19, 2012)

Ktns, for what it's worth some of your interactions with Laurie do come across as confrontational. She is one of the most knowledgable people on this site and the advice you are getting is priceless. I hope you realize that. 

I went through a similar situation with Ziggy a few months back where he just lost all interest in food. I made the effort to learn how to assist feed. It was messy and I got really frustrated at first but I stuck with it and after a few weeks he got his appetite back. You simply have to keep at it and make sure you are getting enough food into her each day. She may not like it. She may fight you. But it's for her own good.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

So... I called the vet to check up on her and somewhat demand the appetite stimulant and the antiemetic. The answer I got was 'hes double booked and might not call you til 130' to which I replied, after $2000 and her still not eating after a week and a half he better call me back. 

I never told you what he said about the appetite stimulant, sorry, he said he has never had much luck with it? Right now, I really dont care and am going to press to get it. I have the pepcid right now, tho he recommended not giving her pills, but liquid instead because he was concerned after all the vomiting her throat was raw and the pills likely would be irritating it more? 

Im going to give her the meds now, go to the store to pick up some baby food and possibly stop by his office to talk to him in person as I also need more Rebound at this point. 

As for being confrontational, I get if it seems like that over text. And Im sorry if it does. My answers are often short and to the point because 1) Im really busy and 2) at the moment I cant afford to be even more of an emotional mess than I already am so my responses might not be gushing. Again, Im sorry if this is the case and if I wasnt appreciative or caring, I wouldnt keep coming back and giving updates/following your advice. 

So just in case I dont say it after every post, please accept my blanket 'thank you'.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

And sorry, where do I get pill pockets?

EDIT: Running those errands now... Im going to stop by the vet. Ill update when I get... something =\


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I did a Google search on IBD yesterday and found a website with what appears to be some very interesting and useful information on the topic and related feline gastric issues:

IBD Kitties - Feline Inflammatory Bowel Disease

Since I have a cat who I believe has either IBD or intestinal lymphoma, I spent some time on the site and found the information on B12 particularly interesting - so much so, in fact, that I am going to call my vet today and have him write me a script for injectible B12 for my boy.

B12

The site also provides lists of canned, dry, and raw cat foods that avoid ingredients known to cause problems for IBD cats. The canned food listing is here:

Wet, canned & Pouches cat food


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## Lucas718 (Feb 19, 2012)

Ktns said:


> And sorry, where do I get pill pockets?
> 
> EDIT: Running those errands now... Im going to stop by the vet. Ill update when I get... something =\


Any pet store should sell them. They're in a green bag and called Greenies Pill Pockets. I picked mine up at Petsmart.


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## Nan (Oct 11, 2010)

Interesting article on the B12!


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Good deal at the vet now... Wish me luck


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

> Ktns said:
> 
> 
> > So... I called the vet to check up on her and somewhat demand the appetite stimulant and the antiemetic. The answer I got was 'hes double booked and might not call you til 130' to which I replied, after $2000 and her still not eating after a week and a half he better call me back.
> ...


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Nan said:


> Interesting article on the B12!


I know! Right? Makes me want to run around my house injecting all of them with B12! (not really) But I do think it's worth adding to the treatment protocols for several of my elderly CRF cats and Noddy. Always looking for that magic bullet, you know?

Laurie


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns, I know I keep throwing more ideas at you, but they keep popping into my head as I go through my memory banks. Here's another one for you - slippery elm bark. I have used SEB on a couple of my cats. For one, it had little noticeable effect. For another, it was almost miraculous.

SEB is a demulcent that coats and soothes everywhere it goes. Given orally, it is used to coat and heal mouth ulcers, soothe sore throats, and coat and soothe the linings of the stomach and intestinal tract. I think there's a good chance that it may make Chii feel comfortable enough to consider eating again.

The following link will provide you with information about SEB. Ignore the fact that it is on the CRF website. SEB is equally effective for gastro-intestinal issues related to any disease.

Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Holistic Treatments

Just as with Pepcid, SEB should be given 2 hrs from any other meds to avoid inhibiting absorption of the other meds (including Pepcid).

In addition to the resources cited on that web page, you should be able to purchase SEB at any health food store.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Okay small update as Im still waiting for whatever they are giving her for appetite stim, Ill pick that up around 1. They gave me Cerenia for nausea. 1/2 tablet which issssss....8mg?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Cerenia is a good option IF her liver is still healthy. However, Cerenia is metabolized through the liver, so it is contraindicated in animals with compromised or questionable liver function.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

He seems pretty sure her liver is still fine? What else can I do at that point?

Also just gave her 20ml Rebound and somewhere betweeen 10-15ml baby food sans onion anything.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

As far as I know, the only way to determine liver function is with another blood test. Of course, if her mucous membranes or the sclera of her eyes turn yellowish, that would also indicate liver disease. But I don't know how severe a liver problem would have to be before it would show up as tissue yellowing.

Sounds like she just got a good meal! That's excellent! Now let's hope she keeps it down. How long ago did you give her the Cerenia? Did the vet give you a timeframe between the dose and her first meal (to give Cerenia time to kick in)?


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

No as I was battling with her not having anything since 8pm last night and 11 this morning. So she kind of got it all in one sitting. I know its not ideal, but I didnt want to make her wait even longer for nourishment and I didnt want to give her food she might not keep down. I just kinda made the best call I could for the time I had. Tomorrow will be a different story as she should be back on her normal regement. I just didnt feed her right away this morning because I wasnt sure what the outcome at the Dr's would be.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Well, don't get discouraged if she vomits this meal. I know that with Noddy, I have to give him at least 30 mins after his metoclopramide dose before I feed him, or he'll vomit the meal. I don't know what the lag time is with Cerenia. Hopefully it'll kick in right away so that Chii can keep her meal down.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

It's been almost an hour so, so far so good. After I finish lunch Im going to lay down and take a nap with her. I was supposed to go back to work today but I couldnt get all of these things dealt with if I went in. 

I feel better that she is at least getting more food. 

The Dr was also confident this IBD was minor enough it wouldnt be forever. So... hopefully after we get her tummy settled and after a couple weeks of this and some cortisone she wont have to deal with this the rest of her life.


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## Penny135 (Apr 6, 2011)

IBD Kitties - Feline Inflammatory Bowel Disease

Since I have a cat who I believe has either IBD or intestinal lymphoma, I spent some time on the site and found the information on B12 particularly interesting - so much so, in fact, that I am going to call my vet today and have him write me a script for injectible B12 for my boy.

B12


I myself get regular B12 injections at my doctors office. I have problems with depression and low energy and it helps soooo much!!!

I would recommend trying it if the vet will write you a script. When you dont feel physically well it can bring you down and you dont feel like eating. Maybe she is dealing with some depression due to all this and doesnt have an appetite.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

That's very encouraging that she's kept her meal down so far. I know what you mean about feeling better after getting food into her. I feel exactly the same way every time I feed Noddy. I have to wait at least 1.5-2 hrs between feedings for Noddy, or he'll vomit in spite of the med. I usually don't like to wake him up to feed him, either, but I do so when he starts dropping weight (as is happening now). This sort of intensive nursing is a labor of love, but it sure can be emotionally exhausting. Funny how emotional exhaustion can be so much more debilitating than physical exhaustion.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Sorry your boy is having issues Laurie :c No one should have to be 'experienced' in this kind of care, it hurts my soul to think of the things youve seen. 

Ive been off almost a week from work and I dont feel like Ive rested at all! You are totally right about emotions. =/ 

C just got her 'lunch'. Since shes a little off her regement today she's not going to be quite up to that 190ml mark but she got another 20ml of Rebound and about 10ml baby food. Total today is 40ml Rebound and 20-25ml of baby food. I know the Rebound is supposed to be 190ml in the event its the *only* thing shes getting, so Im hoping the baby food really offsets this Rebound a little. 

Anyway she gets dinner around 8-830 and so far shes kept down all of the food. Here's hoping!


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns said:


> Sorry your boy is having issues Laurie :c No one should have to be 'experienced' in this kind of care, it hurts my soul to think of the things youve seen.


Thank you. It's always difficult to see one of my beloveds fall ill, but I am so grateful for all that they have taught me over the decades. Every animal spends his/her life teaching me invaluable lessons. During their vital years, they teach me about joy and abandon and silliness and vigor. During their aged years they teach me about calmness, wisdom, peace, and resolve. During illness or injury, they teach me critical nursing skills and inspire me to research their medical conditions, all of which stands to benefit later generations of my 4-legged family members, as well as any animals' lives I have the opportunity to positively impact through friends, family, and the Internet. I am grateful that my animals leave me with these lessons that I can pay forward to those who need them. This is why I sometimes get a bit pushy in my sharing of information. I am compelled to pass along what my animals have taught me in order to honor my beloveds who are no longer with me.



> Ive been off almost a week from work and I dont feel like Ive rested at all! You are totally right about emotions. =/


I know. It can really be draining. There is a great flip side, though. You're going to be so energized when you see Chii getting better and stronger as a result of your efforts. You're already feeling better just getting some food into her.



> Total today is 40ml Rebound and 20-25ml of baby food.


Now that she's on Cerenia and hopefully able to keep food down, you should be able to start feeding her more times during the day. Try for every two hours while you're home, 40 ml per feeding. If she can't handle that amount without vomiting, stretch out the time to three hours and/or reduce the amount to 30 ml per feeding. If she handles 40 ml every two hrs with no problems, increase the amount to 50 ml. There is no set rule for assist feeding. I wouldn't give more than 60 ml per feeding, though.

I can't remember if I already posted this, but you can make a more nutritionally balanced, syringeable food by mixing canned cat food with a little hot water and pureeing it in a kitchen blender. That'll give her the taurine and other nutrients essential to a feline diet that aren't in human baby food. When I make Noddy's slurry, I mix in all sorts of supplements, including Nutri-stat. Nutri-stat (or Nutrical) is a high calorie paste that punches up the caloric value of his syringe feedings, giving him more bang for the buck. If you can't feed numerous times throughout the day and evening, adding Nutrical or Nutri-stat can provide more nutrition per feeding.

Gotta go find Noddy. I gave him and BooBoo their fluids a little while ago. Now it's time for Noddy's next meal, and in 45 minutes, it'll be med time for Noddy, Tommy, and Mew again.

A mommy-nurse's job is never done ...

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

So tired, Ill respond tomorrow, but I wanted to share a pic of my baby


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Aww, Chii is a matching bookend to my Phantom. Lovely girl. How is she doing today?


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Heading out to work, Ill reply to your previous message then, but shes doing well c: She slept with me all night and I wanted to give you a heads up that the Rebound has Taurine (sp?), so even tho that is lacking in the baby food the Rebound should cover it?

Today I am supposed to get the appetite stimulant, Ill let you know what it is and what the dosage is when I get it. Have a good day <3


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns said:


> Rebound has Taurine (sp?), so even tho that is lacking in the baby food the Rebound should cover it?


If Rebound was 100% of her current diet, then yes, it would be covering her taurine requirement. But if Rebound is, say, only 50% of her current diet, then it's only covering half of her taurine requirement. This won't be an issue short-term, but baby food shouldn't be fed long-term without nutrient supplementation.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Cyproheptadine 4mg y/n?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I've used cypro with a couple of my CRF cats. With them, I've given 1/8 tablet (.5 mg) once daily and increased, if necessary, over time. 

With an otherwise healthy cat like Chii, I'd be inclined to start with 1/4 tablet once daily and see how she does. If that's enough to get her eating, there would be no reason to increase the dose. If 1/4 tablet doesn't get her eating on her own in the first 24 hrs, then I'd increase to 1/4 tab every 12 hrs. 

Of course, it's still very important to continue to assist feed and not wait to see if the cypro will do its thing. As I posted yesterday, cypro doesn't work on all cats. Even when it does work, the timing can vary a great deal from cat to cat. Some cats will start eating within 15 mins. Others may not respond to cypro for 48 hrs or more. You just have to give it a try and see if it works for her.

Good luck!

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Ty Laurie I'll try it when I get home from work


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Good deal. Let us know how she does.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Also I'm assuming pill sleeves won't work cause she won't eat. How about a pill dispenser? Never had to use one.


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Pill sleeves? Do you mean Pill Pockets, or empty gelcaps? Either one will work, and if you're really lucky, she might even eat a Pill Pocket on her own. Even if she won't eat it willingly, I have found that cats generally aren't as eager to try to spit out a pill that is hidden in a tasty Pill Pocket. You still may have to drop it in the back of her mouth to get her to swallow it, though. It's also much easier for her to swallow a pill if you give her a ml or two of water (or Rebound) immediately before and after pilling to make sure it doesn't get stuck in a dry throat. You can buy Pill Pockets for a good price here (free shipping and handling if your order totals at least $50):

Pill Pockets for Cats - 45 count | Pet Supplies, Horse Supplies, Dog Supplies | KVsupply.com

If you don't want to buy Pill Pockets, you can buy #3 or #4 size empty gelcaps at a local pharmacy. Put the med into the gelcap, coat it with butter, and pop it into the back of her mouth (again giving water immediately before and after to facilitate swallowing). A piller makes this process MUCH easier (and safer - you won't get your fingers bitten with a piller). There are several different types of pillers available. I have and successfully use both of these:

Pet Piller | Pet Supplies, Horse Supplies, Dog Supplies | KVsupply.com
Dr. Hanson's Bullseye Pillgun | Pet Supplies, Horse Supplies, Dog Supplies | KVsupply.com

Here's a pill cutter, if you need one (you can also buy these at any pharmacy):

Tablet Cutter | Pet Supplies, Horse Supplies, Dog Supplies | KVsupply.com

You might be able to find these things - and Rebound, for that matter - cheaper on amazon.com


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

How's our girl doing today?


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## Mom of 4 (Jul 29, 2006)

Our vet taught me to pill cats the easy way. I hope I can explain it so you can understand.

Gently put the palm of your hand on the top of the cat's head. The thumb and index finger of that hand go on either side of the cat's mouth. Firmly, but gently, press the finger and thumb against the mouth. While keeping the heel of your hand still, rotate the finger and thumb up toward the ceiling, causing the cat's mouth to point up, just enough that the mouth opens. With the other hand, toss the pill toward the back of the throat. Allow the cat's nose to drop just enough that the mouth closes, but still points up. You can gently rub the front of the throat to stimulate swallowing. As soon as the tongue comes out to lick the nose, the pill has been swallowed. Release the cat and cuddle/reward.
The first time I did it, my husband helped, but now I can do it alone.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Nothing has changed, and the nausea pills dont seem to have an effect. She still gags at the sight/smell of food. 

The only difference is that I picked up some pill pockets yesterday and those seem to help a little. She wont eat the entire pocket, but if I break off a bit, coat the pill and massage under her mouth until she swallows it, it works out a lot better than anything else we've done. 

I also picked up some Nutri-Cal to help out with the odds and ends of her nourishment. Im working on getting her some kitten pate, this morning was the test run for that, by tonight Im sure Ill have it down to a science. 

Tonight is her last dose of amoxicilin. The people on one of the assisted feeding boards on Yahoo! suggest that amoxicilin sometimes causes cats to become nauseous. 

I am so tired and at my wits end. I dont know what to do anymore, and the vet last I spoke to him, he didnt know any more either. I could take her for a second opinion, but we just dont have the money right now after the 2k in vet bills and now the money for the meds and other suppliments. 

I gave her some of the cypro last night. She was a little more active and vocal a couple hours after taking it, for about 2 hours, but still didnt eat. I dont want to give up on her, but I dont know what to do anymore. This cant be any way for her to live...


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns said:


> Nothing has changed, and the nausea pills dont seem to have an effect. She still gags at the sight/smell of food.


I know this is really exhausting and frustrating for you, but it's not time to give up yet. It may take a while, but there are other meds and med combinations to try. I feel confident that if you just hang in there and keep your eye on the ultimate goal, you and Chii will get there. 

OK, I know I've thrown a lot of ideas at you. At this point, I'm not sure which meds, which doses, and which med timings you're using with Chii. Could you list everything you're currently giving her so that I'll know where things are now?

The only difference is that I picked up some pill pockets yesterday and those seem to help a little. She wont eat the entire pocket, but if I break off a bit, coat the pill and massage under her mouth until she swallows it, it works out a lot better than anything else we've done. 



> I also picked up some Nutri-Cal to help out with the odds and ends of her nourishment. Im working on getting her some kitten pate, this morning was the test run for that, by tonight Im sure Ill have it down to a science.


That's good. Nutrical will help pump up the caloric value of her feedings with very little extra food volume.



> Tonight is her last dose of amoxicilin. The people on one of the assisted feeding boards on Yahoo! suggest that amoxicilin sometimes causes cats to become nauseous.


GI side effects (vomiting, diarrhea, nausea) can occur with almost all antibiotics, unfortunately. A vet once told me that GI disturbances can continue for up to two weeks following the last dose of some antibiotics. It can be helpful to mix a probiotic into her food once daily during and for about a week after antibiotic use. The probiotic will help repopulate the good gut bacteria that the antibiotic kills off.



> I could take her for a second opinion, but we just dont have the money right now after the 2k in vet bills and now the money for the meds and other suppliments.


Give the meds more time to work. Also, make sure you're timing the meds correctly for maximum effect. Once I know exactly what you're giving her, I can look them up in my vet drug manual and tell you how to time them properly. BTW, there are ways to save substantial money on meds and supplements. Again, I can help you with that once I know what you're giving her.



> I gave her some of the cypro last night. She was a little more active and vocal a couple hours after taking it, for about 2 hours, but still didnt eat.


Like I said yesterday, cypro can take several days to work on some cats, and on some cats it doesn't work at all. How much did you give her last night?



> This cant be any way for her to live...


Granted, this isn't any fun for either one of you right now, but I still believe Chii has the potential for recovery. It'll help you to keep going if you maintain the mindset that this is all temporary, and that once you get Chii over this hump, you will be able to get back to a "normal" life together. It may take a while, but I think there's a good chance that the two of you can get there. In the meantime, once you get into the nursing "rhythm", you'll find that you develop a stronger bond with Chii than you even realized could happen. I promise you, there's always a silver lining to be found, even in the most trying of times.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Thank you for responding, as always Laurie. Sorry my responses get shorter and shorter. I just find myself more exhausted and depressed lately. 

Shes currently on 1.5ml Amox which ends tonight. Other than that shes on 8mg Cerenia per 24 hours, and last night I did a half a pill (2mg) Cypro. Im not giving her anything more of that til around 5pm as that will be the 24 hour mark. She gets her Cerenia at 8am, and her Amox at 8am and 8pm. 

Here are a couple things cut/pasted from the other forum:

The pancreatitis test, spec fPL, is NOT part of the standard blood test. You need to get copies of the labs run. It will be listed as its own test. It is very important to know if she was tested for this and if not, then I would put it very high on the list of suspects here given that you know she has IBD. IBD and pancreatitis often run hand in hand with cats. We can help you make sense of the lab results.

If she does have pancreatitis, then the difference in treatment here would be more emphasis on nausea control. Cerenia doesn't always work for feline nausea (its label indicates it's for vomiting) and ondansetron or dolasetron are often good options. Ondansetron is generic for zofran and what you would need is a written rx from your vet and then you take it to a human pharmacy.

You said the vet gave her a shot of cortisone. Did he say what type and how long it was meant to last? There are different types of steroids and some are short-duration and some are longer duration. Most of the time, for a cat with IBD who needs steroids, you give daily or every other day prednisolone (very inexpensive med by the way).***

I think when I see the vet on Monday Ill ask about the pancreatitis as well as the other two anti-nausea pills, and prednisone. At this point tho, Im about ready to take her to another vet for a second opinion. Any thoughts?


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

Ktns said:


> I just find myself more exhausted and depressed lately.


I know, but you've just got to borrow strength from everyone who's trying to help you and keep the faith that your efforts will pay off. Depression is debilitating, and neither you nor Chii can afford that right now.

First let me tell you how to potentially save money on meds. For any prescription meds, get a written prescription from your vet, then call all of the pharmacies in your area and get pricing on each one. Buy generics, when possible. All of the large retail pharmacies (K-Mart, Walmart, Target, etc.) have discount drug lists. Cyproheptadine, for instance, is (or was last time I bought it) on K-Mart's discount list for $4 or $5 for 30 pills. Even the supplements and liquid diet you're using can be purchased a lot more cheaply online or through pet supply catalogs than they can at most vets. Price shopping can save a ton when nursing sick animals.

Second, have you joined the feline IBD lists yet? I know that joining all of these lists and repeating the same information about Chii is adding to your stress and exhaustion, but those lists are where you're likely to find the information and suggestions that will help you and Chii the most. The Assist Feeding list has already provided you with some very useful information. The IBD lists could provide even more.



> I did a half a pill (2mg) Cypro.


I figured you'd given her more than 1/4 tablet of Cypro, based on her more active and vocal reaction to it. If you'd given her a full tablet, she might have become really manic until it wore off. As long as her reaction to 1/2 tab wasn't disturbing to either you or Chii, then keep her at that dose for a few days and see if it gets her eating.



> The pancreatitis test, spec fPL, is NOT part of the standard blood test. You need to get copies of the labs run. It will be listed as its own test. It is very important to know if she was tested for this and if not, then I would put it very high on the list of suspects here given that you know she has IBD. IBD and pancreatitis often run hand in hand with cats.


One of the ways I determine whether or not to run a test on one of my animals is whether the results of the test would change the way I was treating the animal. Ask the IBD folks if an IBD cat WITH pancreatitis is treated differently than an IBD cat WITHOUT pancreatitis. If there are adjunctive treatments specifically for pancreatitis, then it's certainly worth testing for.



> If she does have pancreatitis, then the difference in treatment here would be more emphasis on nausea control.


You already know you're dealing with nausea just by Chii's response to food, so her treatment should already be focused on nausea control.



> Cerenia doesn't always work for feline nausea (its label indicates it's for vomiting) and ondansetron or dolasetron are often good options.


The following link will provide you with lots of information that may shed light on Chii's appetite, nausea, and vomiting problems. I know she isn't in renal failure, but much of the information is relevant to Chii's symptoms, so it is valuable for you to read. It also provides information on all three drugs mentioned above. BTW, after rereading this link myself, I agree that Ondansetron would probably be a better option for Chii than Cerenia:

Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Nausea, Vomiting, Appetite Loss and Excess Stomach Acid



> Most of the time, for a cat with IBD who needs steroids, you give daily or every other day prednisolone


Yes, I believe I mentioned this to you before. Prednisolone (not prednisone) is the steroid of choice for IBD in cats.



> At this point tho, Im about ready to take her to another vet for a second opinion. Any thoughts?


I think a second opinion is always valuable, assuming the second opinion comes from a competent vet who is interested in taking an active role in Chii's recovery. You don't need another "wait and see" or "I don't know what to do now" vet.

I suggest you continue to give Chii an acid blocker like Pepcid AC (2.5 mg once or twice daily) or Zantac 75 (1/8 tablet twice daily). Excess stomach acid causes nausea and is a common problem in cats who aren't eating sufficiently. Either of these drugs should be separated from other meds by 2 hrs.

I also think it's well worth trying slippery elm bark, which I believe I mentioned in an earlier post. It, too, can be very effective in treating nausea and stomach upset in some cats.

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

I'm just about to pass out for a nap, but I had to tell you!

She just took her first couple bites of wet food!

Not enough to sustain but omg a step!!!! I want to hug you so hard Laurie!


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I do believe I can feel you dancing (and hugging) from here! Hey, be careful with that. Those strong vibrations might cause an earthquake out there in CA! LOL!

I am soooo happy that Chii took in some food on her own, even if it was only a couple of bites. Hey, she had to start somewhere! Keep offering her a small amount of fresh food (not cold from the fridge) every few hours. Hopefully, she'll keep trying it out.

Oh, here's another strategy that another poster reminded me of in a different thread. Take an empty Pill Pocket or other treat and "accidentally" drop it on the floor near Chii. Cats are always more attracted to "found" or "stolen" food, so she might snatch up a treat that she thinks she's not supposed to have. Just don't offer it to her directly, and don't do anything to give her the impression that you want her to eat it. 

Congratulations! There will probably continue to be steps forward and steps back during her recovery, but she's on her way!

Laurie


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Laurie! Chii started eating dry food yesterday, and enough of it to where we are just giving her Rebound again. I know about dry food now, but this is what we have a 30lb bag of and what shes used to. After this bag runs out we will be changing *all* their diets. 

She got her stitches out today and has been changed to Onestradon (sp?). Also she has been having so much more energy and spent some time outside with me today, here is an updated pic c: Her tummy isnt really that red, I had to change the saturation a bit because of the lighting.


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## Ktns (Apr 25, 2012)

Also! After all of this, she still only lost only 2.20lbs. Shes still a healthy 12.26lbs c:


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## Nan (Oct 11, 2010)

So happy to hear she is eating again!


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## laurief (Jun 22, 2008)

I can't tell you how happy this makes me! And don't worry for one second about feeding her dry food right now. When a cat isn't eating, the rule is to let her eat whatever she wants to eat, as long as it's not toxic. So under these circumstances, dry food is FANTASTIC! Sure, it'd be great to switch her (very, very gradually) to canned later on, but don't do anything to rock the boat right now.

She looks pretty doggone satisfied in that latest photo. She also gives the impression of being very long-legged. Is she an especially tall cat? 12.26 lbs is large for a female. 

I hope you can get some decent rest now that Chii is eating decently. Congratulations on getting her over the hump!

Laurie


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